Author Topic: fixing the dreaded SHUDDER at takeoff  (Read 388 times)

Iahawk

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fixing the dreaded SHUDDER at takeoff
« on: May 06, 2020, 09:24:37 PM »
Well the time had come to fix the bad shudder at takeoff. It's been happening over the past year or more...a pretty hard, violent shaking / shudder at takeoff.  I was assuming glazed clutch pads or bell, even though I try to always give it a lot of gas at takeoff, avoiding a slow gentle takeoff.

i went into full Indy pit mechanic mode...stripping my seat, fender, rack and plastic tub off in about 12 minutes. 5 nuts, 4 screws, 5 bolts and 3 electrical connections gets it done. I've done it enough that it is very easy...first time it probably took over an hour..or two..
« Last Edit: May 07, 2020, 01:23:28 AM by Iahawk »
2010 People S200 - sold after 8 wonderful years!
2014 Ninja 300
1996 Honda Helix
1984 Honda Nighthawk 650 - work in progress

Iahawk

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Re: fixing the dreaded SHUDDER at takeoff
« Reply #1 on: May 06, 2020, 09:28:22 PM »
then off comes the cvt cover to get to the clutch bell and clutch. As expected, the clutch pads were glazed over.

Some Brake Kleen and 100 grit sandpaper and they were all cleaned up. Brake Kleen and a green scotchbrite cleaned up the bell.

Took her for a ride today and it felt great..no shudder at all. It had almost become unpleasant to ride with the shuddering...but the fix is quick and easy and worth it.
2010 People S200 - sold after 8 wonderful years!
2014 Ninja 300
1996 Honda Helix
1984 Honda Nighthawk 650 - work in progress

TBR125

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Re: fixing the dreaded SHUDDER at takeoff
« Reply #2 on: May 06, 2020, 11:18:57 PM »
Great work. How long does it take for the clutch pads to glaze? Or does it depend on the bike and riding style?
Become the best you can with what you have.

Stig / Major Tom

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Re: fixing the dreaded SHUDDER at takeoff
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2020, 12:19:45 AM »
Goodness! do you have to remove all of that to get the belt cover off?!
Nice looking scooter, by the way!
(found a red one with 8 miles on it at a used car lot awhile back - he wouldn't budge for 2 yrs on it. A repo - poor guy barely made it home - 8 miles! had a cracked front leg shield.. but lovely red color)

Sometimes I think the business of fixing a juddering clutch - is more art than science!
Had it one time on my LIKE200i - did the glaze thing - and it has stayed away and been butter smooth for 6 years now.
Wonder if it had something to do with the new (14g) Dr Pulleys I installed?
 
Burgman had it pretty good - really had to be brisk with the throttle to keep it away.

Lot of miles left on your clutch pads!!

Stig

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Rural Ohio

And, I'm feeling a little peculiar.

Iahawk

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Re: fixing the dreaded SHUDDER at takeoff
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2020, 01:33:03 AM »
Great work. How long does it take for the clutch pads to glaze? Or does it depend on the bike and riding style?

great question...and I think the answer is "it depends' (?). Some people seem to go forever with no glazing and others have an ongoing issue. The general recommendation is to avoid leisurely starts as this can contribute to glazing.

A search I did online for shudder on takeoff turned up a lot of Burgman, Forza, Vespa owners talking about this issue...so I wonder if the bigger scoots have more of an issue?

The good news is it's a quick and easy fix if the problem does come up.
2010 People S200 - sold after 8 wonderful years!
2014 Ninja 300
1996 Honda Helix
1984 Honda Nighthawk 650 - work in progress

Iahawk

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Re: fixing the dreaded SHUDDER at takeoff
« Reply #5 on: May 07, 2020, 01:40:33 AM »
Goodness! do you have to remove all of that to get the belt cover off?!

Unfortunately, yes. I love this scooter but to do anything seems to require full plastics removal! Rear bulbs and sparkplug access both require removing everything I did here. The good news is that I can do it fast. I feel sorry for new owners of this model as it's a pain to figure out the process.

My scooter spends most of its life in my garage so it's easy to keep it clean, but thanks for the compliment, Stig.
2010 People S200 - sold after 8 wonderful years!
2014 Ninja 300
1996 Honda Helix
1984 Honda Nighthawk 650 - work in progress

TBR125

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Re: fixing the dreaded SHUDDER at takeoff
« Reply #6 on: May 07, 2020, 01:03:11 PM »
If glazing is leisurely starts I will never worry. Makes sense that the heavier bikes would have more energy and heat when slipping the clutch.
Become the best you can with what you have.

Fogie

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Re: fixing the dreaded SHUDDER at takeoff
« Reply #7 on: May 07, 2020, 01:22:27 PM »
Prior to the Kymco, I had a Piaggio product that had a press-on cap on the outside of the clutch bell. Whenever shudder developed, all you had to do was pop off the cap and blast the dust out of the bell with an air compressor; it cleared up the problem immediately. When I bought the Kymco, I noticed shudder as soon as I drove away from the dealer, but hoped it was just some temporary condition resulting from newness. Since the Kymco has no convenient access to the clutch internals, I was worried about how involved it might be to solve the problem if it didn't clear itself up. Well, 8 years have gone by and the shudder it still there, but to a much less-noticeable extent; nowadays it doesn't seem to happen on take-off, but only occurs when accelerating lightly in a low-speed traffic crawl. Since the clutch has never been touched, I attribute the lack of significant shudder development to the fact that I always accelerate briskly on take-offs, thereby minimizing clutch slip.
2012 Kymco Frost (Yager) 200i - Toronto, Canada

john grinsel

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Re: fixing the dreaded SHUDDER at takeoff
« Reply #8 on: May 07, 2020, 02:38:52 PM »
Of the 2 new Honda 600 SilverWing I had,, the first one had some clutch chatter for its whole 50,000 mile life with me---never took anything apart---simply run engine up against brakes and it would go away for awhile. Second one smooth for its whole near 50,000 mile life with me.  My current Kymco is smooth.

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