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Messages - AZCycle

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Technical | How To / Adding Auxiliary Lights...
« on: January 13, 2009, 09:29:27 PM »
This is a cross-post from the B&W250 forum but since that section is covered in cobwebs and dust, I figured I should post a link to it from here.

http://www.kymcoforum.com/index.php?topic=521.0

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Technical | How To / Re: How to Change Your Belt! :D
« on: January 13, 2009, 09:26:14 PM »
A few questions about your great writeup!

1) I've got a 2002 B&W250 that has it's original belt.  The original two owners hardly used it, so it's still only got about 4000 miles (converted from kilometer).  Should I change the belt simply due to age or is it safe to go another 2,000 miles or so?

2) Also... I'd like to perhaps change the rollers to slightly more performance-based ones. Is this easy for the average shade-tree mechanic to accomplish?

3) Do I really need an air-impact wrench?  All I've got is elbow-grease. ;)

3
Bet & Win 250 / Adding running lights to empty turn signal pods
« on: January 13, 2009, 06:02:54 PM »
I've been fascinated with the empty turn signal pods on my B&W250 since the first day I purchased it.  After doing some research and doing quite a bit of electrical work on a 1976 Honda Goldwing, I figured I'd like to take a stab at installing some running lights.  I'm always concerned about my visibility (as should all motorcycle riders) so this was more for increasing my visual footprint more than for night riding.

I wanted LED lights because they don't draw as much power and generate as much heat as filament bulbs.  I knew that they wouldn't be as bright, but as I mentioned before... this was more about oncoming visibility rather than illuminating the road in front of me.

I searched online and found a plethora of good websites offering reasonable LED lights and automotive sockets. I purchased two bases, two "super bright," single-circuite 15-LED lights, and two super-bright LEDs (for the small running lights - green outline) for about $50 total.  I looked closely at the "chrome" reflective pods (orange outline) on the B&W and knew with a little cutting and shaping, I could get the new sockets to fit.  So that's what I did!  I wish I had photos of this process, but it was fairly easy.  The plastic is VERY soft and easily cut/trimmed.  I cut notches into the pods to match the light bases so they would slip in and turn to hold them in.  No need for glue and I can easily remove them for future use.



To do all of this, you must remove the entire front of the scooter, which is not a difficult job (removing 12 or so screws).  But just be warned at the plastic screw mounts on the body panels are VERY delicate!  I broke two of them in my bumbling of taking it off/putting it back together multiple times!

Figuring I could tie them into the "running lights" (green outline in photo) that already exist on the B&W, I got to work. The running lights on the B&W are the small, triangular shaped lights on either side of the main headlight (yellow outline).  The lights themselves were very easy to wire.  Soldering and heat-shrinking is a good thing to do, as the wires are exposed to some road grime, etc. While you can get by with electrical tape, it most likely will start to loosen over time.

Here is where I made mistake #1, and thankfully my only mistake.  Please do not do what I did, or you will be buying a new headlight bulb (or two, like me) and they are not cheap! 

So the new bases have two wires, one black and one white.  White is power, black is ground.  I had to extend each wire about 8" or so to reach the running light wires and did so with 12-gauge wire. I soldered two  ring terminals to the extended ground wires and bolted them behind the lower horn bolt, which had a good contact with the frame.  Each existing running light has two wires... brown for power, green for ground.  I ran the extended power wires up from the pod and spliced them into each running light power wire (brown). 

Done, right? Well, no. I turned everything on and was ecstatic to see my new LED lights power on!  It was after dark, so I took her for a spin around the block.  Five-minutes into my ride... POW!...my headlight burned out.  No low OR high beam.  So I limped back home on the running lights, figuring the headlight bulb was old and it was just coincidence.  Electrical problems are rarely coincidental but I was in denial.   ::)

So the next day I purchased a NEW headlight bulb online ($20) and waited a week for it to arrive.  Installed it, went for a test ride and sure enough... POW... it burned out.  After a few very creative and choice words, I was ready to call it quits.  The next day I stopped by the local scooter shop and ordered another headlight ($45!)

I realized that I was overpowering the headlight circuit, even with the low-draw LEDs.  But I knew that highway cruiser riders add all sorts of lights to their bikes, so they had to do it somehow, right?  Researching online I found exactly what I needed:  From Value Accessories, a "generic" dedicated wiring harness specifically for adding running lights to motorcycles for $35.  I could have done it cheaper myself but I liked how this harness had protection from the elements and had a built-in on/off switch.  The wiring harness has it's own relay and fuse, and is tied to the battery directly so it doesn't draw off any existing circuit (much.)

So once again, I removed the front cover and this time, the seat as well.  I think the most difficult job was running the harness through the bodywork. You must make sure the harness does not interfere with any moving parts and that it will not catch on the fork when you turn!  I used zip ties to keep it next to the frame.  I also removed the white tank in the left of the picture to help run the harness through to the front. You can see the new black harness just below the grey body panel (it's the wire that isn't dirty. :D)


The harness DOES need to be tied into the circuit that turns on/off with your key, so the old running light wires that I had previously used were perfect, as they were already stripped of a section of insulation.  The difference here is that the new harness only uses the existing powered wires to engage the circuit... it does NOT pull enough power to hurt anything.  In this photo, you can see the harness and on/off switch (lying over the headlight), the new running light grounds tied to the horn bolt (yellow) and the two splices into the existing running lights (red and green blocks that look like Legos).


I then replaced the seat assembly, running the new harness up through the same hole the battery wires use. Using sticky velcro strips, I secured the relay (black box with white wires).  The two wires coming from the relay are white (power with inline fuse) and black (ground). I soldered two more ring terminals onto these wires and installed the battery.  The white wire goes to the positive terminal of the battery, and black negative.  You can trim the excess if you wish, but I left them long and secured the wires out of the way.


I then mounted the on/off switch inside the front grille panel so I can reach in and turn it on/off whenever I wish. If you leave it "on" the new auxiliary lights will turn on and off along with your low beam headlight and stock running lights. The switch is hardly noticeable unless you look closely.  Make sure the wires won't interfere with the fan! You can see the switch in the far left vertical air-vent:


Before (with new running lights OFF) view from the cockpit:


After (with new running lights ON) view from the cockpit. You can barely see a blue "glow" outside the white/yellow headlight.  As I mentioned, this is not really for any additional night riding help, but more for oncoming visibility.


Before (with new running lights OFF) view from the front:


After (with new running lights ON) view from the front:



Overall impression:  I'm really happy with them!  I think it gives the B&W a little extra visual "oomph" and makes it unique.  Not counting the $65 spent on blown-out headlights, my overall cost was roughly $100.  I already had the wiring terminals, wire, heat-shrink and soldering material so if you dno't have those, it'll cost more.  But it was worth the experience and fun-factor.

I also think that now that the lights have their own dedicated circuit you could add very bright "normal" filament type (or brighter LEDs) if you did want better night visibility.

Sorry for the long post, but I thought some of you might like this safety mod.



4
General Discussion / Re: What made you get a Kymco?
« on: January 08, 2009, 09:03:19 PM »
I really wasn't interested in scooters until I met my girlfriend two years ago, who owned a TNG Milano 150 (yes, a Chinese Scoot).  She bought it from the local scooter store who has since stopped carrying them because they're a nightmare company to deal with, as expected.  She still has it and it's running well, so we're keeping our fingers crossed.

Anyway... I was very interested in hers and we stopped by the scooter shop (www.goscootover.com/) on a routine basis for me to drool. They carried Modern Buddy and Kymco and I was starting to save up to get a MB Rattler 110.  Then, as I was perusing the local Craigslist, I came across this guy selling a 2002 Kymco Bet & Win 250 with only 2000 miles on it.  I was instantly sold!

We went and looked at it that evening and I fell in love.  Unfortunately, the cheap price was due to it having a salvage title.  Apparently the first owner rear-ended (at low speed) a pickup truck with it's tailgate down.  The owner was unhurt but all the plastics on the front end and windshield were smashed, as well as some scrapes on the right side when she dumped it after colliding.  So it was considered a total loss, even though the body was straight, etc.

The 2nd owner bought it as is at an auction, fixed it up with all new plastics, and that's when I bought it.  It still has the scrapes on the right side (very minor) and he never purchased the outside temperature sensor but I don't really care about that.  So that's how I got my B&W 250.  I use it to commute 13-miles each way to work 3-5 days a week and just love it.

I already added some driving lights to the lower turn signal pods for better visability, and I'd like to add some performance upgrades after new tires.




And here is the local scooter group (of all makes/models) at a run up Mt Lemmon.  Mine is on the far left:

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General Discussion / Re: Is this site active?
« on: January 08, 2009, 08:50:37 PM »
I'm here and lurking but don't post much.  I did just recently install driving lights in my Bet and Win 250's lower turn signal pods.  Looks awesome!  I'll post some pics and a tutorial as soon as I upload all the pics.


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I didn't realize you had responded so sorry for my late addition.  Glad you found the manual. As to your air filter question... I wish I could help. I'm not sure if the crankcase is ventilated through the airbox, but I *think* so.  When I cleaned my air filter it smelled slightly of fuel as well... though it wasn't discolored.

7
Thanks for the comments - I appreciate the help.  The scooter was serviced in early August, full service including fluids and a new battery.  I suspect it was not being used much before and since then.  In looking at the battery it is a little low (12.7v) and the readout indicates only 2 'dots' out of 6(?).  I did not get an owner's manual with the scooter so it is a bit of an Easter egg hunt locating things. 

One other thing that came up in another discussion that I did not find an answer to is the engine kill switch.  Is it supposed to be in a particular position (on = the scooter engine will not run, off = the scooter engine will run) when the bike is parked/stored for longer lengths of time and does this affect the amount of draw on the battery?   

Meanwhile, I'll check things out and let you know what I find. 

Well I think its a good habit to turn off the kill switch when it's not in use but as to it affecting battery draw I wouldn't think so.  I think only the key "on" would suck power from the battery. Motorcycle/scooter batteries can die pretty quickly if not used or charged regularly so even with a "new" battery in August, it might be pretty low.  I'd purchased a motorcycle trickle-charger and keep it on that when not in use.

When my battery died, it was sluggish to start and yes, the battery display only showed about 2-3 "dots." Mine went bad so fast that it wouldn't even hold a charge overnight.  So $65 later and a new battery, no problems.

I didn't get an owner's manual with mine either, but luckily the local scooter shop had a nice employee with one and he copied it for me.  PM me and I'd be happy to send you a copy either via snail mail or I can scan it and send it to you as a PDF. 

You mentioned how they are supposed to idle a bit fast on startup until they warm.  Mine does this half the time, and the other half it just idles normally (I think they should idle about 1400rpm).  I haven't set mine on a real dwell-meter/tachometer and set the idle by the dashboard display, with is obviously difficult to get exact.  I think my biggest problem is it not returning to idle when I come to a red light.  About half the time, it stays revved-up around 3000rpm.  I then have to give it a quick 'punch' of throttle, which will knock the idle back down.  I still may have clogged jets.

Good luck, and feel free to PM me if you want a copy of the owner's manual.

8
This thread is absolutely perfect - thanks for all the tips. 

I, too, just brought home a used B&W 250 with about 11k km.  It is in great shape except that it doesn't start convincingly and when it does catch it idles rough.  As I understand, it should idle at faster rpm until it warms up a bit.  This  never happens.  Any thoughts would be appreciated.  Thanks.

Could be a few things but probably fuel/air related.  Have you cleaned/replaced the air filter?  When was the last time it had a tune up?  Maybe needs a new spark plug.  If it sat without running for a while, there very well could be varnish built up in the carb bowl and jets.  There is a product called Sea Foam (buy it at any auto parts store). Add it per the directions to a few tanks of gas and it will do WONDERS to clean out the carb. Don't use it constantly, but running a few tanks of gas with it added will do a lot.  Once that cleans things out, you can probably play with the idle/fuel screw to set your idle better.

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Hey gtexan... looks exactly like mine...And I bought mine used as well. Looks like your questions have been answered.  I don't like riding at night but have been forced to on a few occasions.  One thing I noticed about "our" B&W is that the lighting is really not adequate at all. I ride with the high beam on 100% of the time. What I plan on doing is adding higher intensity bulbs LEDs to the running lights AND adding additional high-intensity LEDs to the empty lower turn signal pods.  I figure this should help with night riding AND make me more visible to oncoming cars. All without adding too much of an electrical load.

Those lower lights are actually the turn signals for the model in Asian countries. But the US/Canada require the turn signals to be higher (more visible) so they just ran the wires up to the handlebar mounted lights.  The orange "bulb" you see below isn't a bulb at all but an orange plastic cap that would fit over the bulb.  It's just an empty socket.

I'll post a topic about the process when I do it (probably next month).


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General Discussion / Newbie in Tucson, AZ
« on: September 29, 2008, 05:06:39 PM »
Hello all!  Newbie here with my first post.  I got interested in scooters after I started dating my girlfriend. She has a TN'G 150cc Milano she purchased through the local scooter shop.  About six months ago, once my finances were in order, I started looking online and immediately read all the horror stories of bad Chinese scooters so I started lurking around the local shop.  By that time, they had given up selling TN'G due to bad relations, and began carrying Kymco as well as Genuine. 

I was REALLY interested in getting a new Genuine Rattler 110cc but as I was perusing my local Craigslist one day, I saw the most awesome scooter ever!  I called the guy immediately and was lucky enough to be the first caller.  That night, we drove up to see it, and I was instantly in love.  A 2002 Kymco Bet and Win 250cc (grey and blue) with only 2000 kilometers on the meter.  Took it for a spin around the block and was REALLY hooked.  Awesome power, good handling and it just felt "right." 

But the low price became apparent when he said it had a salvaged title. :(  Apparently the first owner rear-ended a parked pickup truck at low speed.  She wasn't hurt and the scoot wasn't damaged horribly but it was enough that the insurance totalled it. Broken windshield, front fairing, headlight, right side fairing has a scratch (but not cracked), and the muffler cover is scratched.  So anyway, the 2nd owner bought it from an auction, replaced all the broken plastics, had it inspected (passed) and then decided to sell it.  The only thing he didn't replace is the outside temperature sensor so it just flashes blank at me.  I might replace it if it's cheap enough. :)

So I got it for a STEAL with hardly any miles.  I've been riding it almost every day to work (24-miles round trip) and just love it.  Change the oil routinely and am going to be replacing the original tires here next month as they're developing cracking next to the rims.

I'm interested in a big-bore kit to bring it up to 300cc's and might purchase a windshield and/or a trunk if I can find them used.  One thing I really don't like is how bad the headlight is at night.  So what I want to do is add some ultra-bright LEDs to the empty "turn signal" pods next to the front fork/shocks.  I figure it would be a pretty easy job to wire them into the upper running lights.  I'm also going to purchase a taillight modulator that flashes the brake light when stopping.

New (to me):


I also took it up Mt Lemmon, which is a 50-mile round trip climb up the local mountain.  It's about 7,000 feet of twisty, turning road that climbs from the saguaro-cactus desert into the cool pine trees.  Here is a picture at the top (9,000 feet) at "ski valley."  (Sorry, bad phone camera image.)



Anyway... nice to meet you all!

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