KymcoForum.com
Scooters - 125 to 300 => Downtown 300 => Topic started by: Nireen999 on July 21, 2016, 02:05:45 PM
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I have only put 3800km's on my bike and the back tire seems to be wearing strangely.. or is it just the way it is. It is looking flat in the middle of it. Is this normal.
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That would be normal if you are not taking wild high speed corners, then the middle trends to wear out faster, and especially so if your really enjoy those crazy fast pull aways to get in front of the traffic.
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Is this the factory tire?
When you replace it (I would suggest you do it soon) go for something better.
There are so called dual compound tires, which have a harder rubber area in the middle for longetivity, and softer compound on the sides for grip in corners. Please see this illustration:
(http://www.motorcycle.com/gallery/gallery.php/d/320016-2/ROADSMART-II_Illo_B_lr.jpg?g2_GALLERYSID=TMP_SESSION_ID_DI_NOISSES_PMT)
(http://images0.revzilla.com/product_images/0048/2215/michelin_power_pure_sc_scooter_tire_zoom.jpg)
Some of these tires are:
Michelin Powerpure SC or
Dunlop Scootsmart
Pirelli Diablo
etc.
Everyone has his/her preference,
I have the Michelin Powerpure SC both front and rear, and they're awesome. Even in ever raining England.
Heard the same about the Dunlop scootsmarts.
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Thanks everyone. I appreciate your comments. :)
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I just put Metzeler Feel Free tires on my DT , they have awesome grip in dry and wet conditions.
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I just put on my 4th set of Metzeler Feel Free on Lil Beastie (my DT) this week.
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There was an brand new Avon Viper Stryke (who the hell thinks these names up!?) on the rear and an (almost) done Metzler boot on the front.
As this set up (any set up up for that matter) is well beyond my capabilities/levels of bravery anyway, I've just ordered a matching replacement Avon for the front.
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I had the Avon Viper Stryke on the rear. In dry conditions it was really good. In wet, and I mean the slightest train, IT WAS AWFUL. SCARY! Dangerous.
I swapped it for the Michelin and I literally got a new scooter! On dry just as good as the Avon. In wet amazingly good. It makes me almost to brave in corners.
Front maxxis tire was too sensitive on all road marks. And it had an unusual thread wear. So I swapped that for a Michelin too and never looked back.
The reason for choosing Michelin was price. I was contemplating between the power pure (Michelin) the scoot smart (Dunlop) and the feel free (Metzler). Any of these is a good choice I believe.
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I ordered a back tire which will cost me about $140 and I don't recall the name but will be checking it!
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That flat wear pattern is absolutely normal.
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I hope it's a very good tire, for that price. I paid $140 for both front and rear Metzeler's wth delivery from Amazon. A good tire makes all the difference, when it comes to safety. Give us an update on your purchase,please.
-Rich
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I sure will do that :) Should have it today or tomorrow. :)
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I had the Avon Viper Stryke on the rear. In dry conditions it was really good. In wet, and I mean the slightest train, IT WAS AWFUL. SCARY! Dangerous.
Well I live in one of the wettest, most miserable countries in the world, ridden bikes of all types for 30 plus years though all weather and the Avon tyre was fine (apart from the silly name of course) on all types of surfaces - and I would pretty much say that for all modern tyres sold in the UK these days.
...and I can't honestly believe Avon would deliberately market a 'dangerous' tyre.
It depends on how you're riding the bike I guess.
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I have found the Michelin city grips give me the most mileage. Have heard the Michelin P. Pures are good also with there dual compound rubber? I am at 65,000 miles now on my xciting 500. :-*
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My new tire friends is called: BRIDGESTONE :)
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Just got the new tire put on today and the boy's at the garage said it was a really tuff tire! BridgeStone it is. :)
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Glad to hear you've got a brand spanking new rear tire fitted. I'm sure it will be much better than old one with the "flat middle".
Make sure you ride more cautiously for the first 50-80km on the new tire. You need to remove the factory protective layer from the running surfaces before you can ride normally.
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LOL yes I had my warning when I left the garage a wee bit to fast to get onto the street. Did a little dance in the back. :P
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Yes. You got to be careful. That stuff is slippery like silicone.
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Lesson learned!!! :)
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Yes. You got to be careful. That stuff is slippery like silicone.
And far more effective than a high fibre diet.
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:D yes
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I have only put 3800km's on my bike and the back tire seems to be wearing strangely.. or is it just the way it is. It is looking flat in the middle of it. Is this normal.
Hi, I'm new here and new to scooters. But I have been riding for 35 years :) Mostly heavy touring bikes. And the problem you show in your picture is a well known problem. But I think I have a solution that you can try ;)
My scooter is a Kawasaki J300. And that is a Kymco Downtown with Kawasaki badges. I live in Norway, and scooters are not the most common bikes here. You can only buy Kymco mopeds here, so when I wanted a Kymco Downtown, I had to buy a Kawasaki J300. And then I found this forum and registered. I think this forum is a nice source for information, and I hope I can contribute with information as well when I get into this "scooter-thing" ;D
One thing I have learned over the years is that air pressure is very important on bikes. To low pressure will give you the wear that you show in your picture. I have 3600 km on my scooter now, and my rear wheel is still round and fine. And I do a lot of straight highway with high speed and heavy load of luggage.
In the owners manual it says 33kpi pressure in the rear wheel with full load. I have used 36 kpi. If you look at the side of the tire, you will find a "max load", and thats the pressure you can use to get most milage out of your tires.
The thing is that the worst enemy for the tires is heat. The warmer the tires get, the faster they wear. And they wear most in the middle. If you use higher pressure in your tires you lower the working temp, and therefore get more km out if it.
Eventually the tire will be flat in the middle anyway, if you drive normally. But you will get much more km if you use the max pressure stated at the side of the tire.
I can mention that on my last touring bike, a Kawasaki 1200 Voyager, I got 10K km on a rear tire when I followed Kawasakis recommended tire pressure. I used Metzler tires on that bike. When I talked to Metzler, they said I should use the pressure stated on the tire, and then I got 18K km out of a rear tire.
Just my 2 cents :) Hope this will be useful. And I hope my English is readable ;D
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Sissymary, I hope to catch up with you regarding mileage.
I like this xc500 too much to part with it.
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Hi, I'm new here and new to scooters. But I have been riding for 35 years :) Mostly heavy touring bikes. And the problem you show in your picture is a well known problem. But I think I have a solution that you can try ;)
My scooter is a Kawasaki J300. And that is a Kymco Downtown with Kawasaki badges. I live in Norway, and scooters are not the most common bikes here. You can only buy Kymco mopeds here, so when I wanted a Kymco Downtown, I had to buy a Kawasaki J300. And then I found this forum and registered. I think this forum is a nice source for information, and I hope I can contribute with information as well when I get into this "scooter-thing" ;D
One thing I have learned over the years is that air pressure is very important on bikes. To low pressure will give you the wear that you show in your picture. I have 3600 km on my scooter now, and my rear wheel is still round and fine. And I do a lot of straight highway with high speed and heavy load of luggage.
In the owners manual it says 33kpi pressure in the rear wheel with full load. I have used 36 kpi. If you look at the side of the tire, you will find a "max load", and thats the pressure you can use to get most milage out of your tires.
The thing is that the worst enemy for the tires is heat. The warmer the tires get, the faster they wear. And they wear most in the middle. If you use higher pressure in your tires you lower the working temp, and therefore get more km out if it.
Eventually the tire will be flat in the middle anyway, if you drive normally. But you will get much more km if you use the max pressure stated at the side of the tire.
could you send a picture of your J 300, we cant get them here,. in Canada and USA,. did they change the seat so it is more comfortable, my downtown sloped to the front and gave me a wedgy every time I put the brake on,. so I rebuilt the seat ,
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I would also like to see a picture of the j300. I was researching them, before I bought my DT300, but couldn't find anywhere in North America. I love my DT, I did however like the black and green j300, I saw pictures of
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Off course I can post pictures. :)
Brand new:
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y289/gamlebla/IMG_0460.jpg) (http://s7.photobucket.com/user/gamlebla/media/IMG_0460.jpg.html)
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y289/gamlebla/IMG_0458.jpg) (http://s7.photobucket.com/user/gamlebla/media/IMG_0458.jpg.html)
At home for the first time:
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y289/gamlebla/IMG_0494.jpg) (http://s7.photobucket.com/user/gamlebla/media/IMG_0494.jpg.html)
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y289/gamlebla/IMG_0495.jpg) (http://s7.photobucket.com/user/gamlebla/media/IMG_0495.jpg.html)
Out in the forests in Sweeden:
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y289/gamlebla/IMG_0566.jpg) (http://s7.photobucket.com/user/gamlebla/media/IMG_0566.jpg.html)
On gravel road in Norway:
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y289/gamlebla/IMG_0578.jpg) (http://s7.photobucket.com/user/gamlebla/media/IMG_0578.jpg.html)
With the new top box:
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y289/gamlebla/IMG_0602.jpg) (http://s7.photobucket.com/user/gamlebla/media/IMG_0602.jpg.html)
Front of the seat and a new back pack that fits in front of the seat:
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y289/gamlebla/IMG_0617.jpg) (http://s7.photobucket.com/user/gamlebla/media/IMG_0617.jpg.html)
I find that I tend to slide back in the seat agains the back support, so the seat is higher in front. You sit in a well so to speak.
Mine is the black version. You can get it in a special edition with green stripes.
I hope Nireen999 excuse me for posting pictures of my bike in her tread :-[
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We'll perhaps have to agree to disagree about proper two-wheel tire pressures.
Both of the service counter personnel at my Honda mega store motorcycle shop and my local multi-brand motorcycle and scooter shop tell me to use the PSI listed on the scooter/motorcycle sticker and in the owner's manual.
Do NOT, they say, inflate and ride at the max pressure printed on the tire.....whether riding solo or two-up or heavily loaded. That figure is not meant to replace or augment the recommended PSI for the wheel/tire/scooter combo.
At least two things will happen if you over-inflate the tire like that:
1) you will immediately notice a harsher ride
2) you will decrease the tire contact patch & thus alter the designed handling - which you may or may not notice when riding
Solid tires will give you longer mileage, too. But mileage is not the sole purpose of a tire on most any vehicle.....and certainly not on motorcycles or scooters which need to make good and predictable contact across their rounded surface.
Tire and rim sizes are designed specifically for each bike. Stepping outside of manufacturer's recommended PSI changes the tire shape & ride behavior characteristics.
Car tires on a scooter last a long time, too. Their box shape & road contact profile are different than the round shape of a scooter tire. Watch the youtube video with the gopro mounted under a scooter using a car tire. Some folks have no problem using car tires - even after watching what that car tire does on a turn.
To each his own - but I'll stick with trained guys who make their living servicing bikes & scooters.
I'll soon be at 10,000 miles on my pair of Michelin City Grips, running on the PSI in the owner's manual.
Stig
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For the Maxxis we talk about 10% more pressure in the rear tire. 33 psi on the sticker versus 36 on the wall of the tire. I don't know how much more km's that will give, but from the picture Nireen999 posted compared to my rear tire at 3600 km it seams that it will give a lot more km's. And 10% more air pressure will not be noticeable or give any dangerous effects. I would say that a tire that is flat in the middle is far more dangerous.
On my Voyager Kawasaki recommended 36 psi in the rear wheel. Metzler said at least 46 psi. I used the same word as Stig when I talked to them and they answered that they had more knowledge about tires than Kawasaki had. They even had it in writing on their website, but I can't find it now. I'll keep looking and post it when I find it.
My experience with the Voyager tires was that I never experienced any drawback when it came to performance or grip. In all kind of weather and road surfaces for over 65K miles. And here we talk about 30% up on recommended pressure.
But everyone must choose what they want to try. I just wanted to tell about what I was recommended, and what's working good for me. ;) Maybe the most important thing is to check the tire pressure often. Many folks drive around with to low pressure most of the time.
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Very nice!!! Hope you have lots of good,fun miles. Ride Safe
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Jalmar, welcome over from advrider.
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and its the nice seat too
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Love that bike! Nice looking too!
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I very recently traded up from a Like200i with Michelin City tires to a new DT with stock tires. Ugh. I feel like they have no grip. Wondering if anyone has tried both the Michelin City (City Slicks? City Grips? I forget) and the Michelin Power Pure and could offer some comparisons? Thx.
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2011 downtown 80,000 km. I am on my 4 th set of tires ,. I have 150/70 13 rear tire city grip,. 120/80 14 front tire power pure, because they don't make city grips for the front tire120/80 14,. I do like the way my scooter handles with this set up.
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I've got power pure s both front and rear. They are fantastic. Can't even compare to stock doughnuts. I can only recommend them.
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Seems Pirelli now is available in our size for the Diablo Rosso.
Anyone have any reviews for this?
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They always go flat like this. I don't do sharp Corning.
Glad to hear you've got a brand spanking new rear tire fitted. I'm sure it will be much better than old one with the "flat middle".
Make sure you ride more cautiously for the first 50-80km on the new tire. You need to remove the factory protective layer from the running surfaces before you can ride normally.
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Jalmar, I love your 2 cents!! My book say's 32 psi and my tire itself says 40psi. What do I do?
Hi, I'm new here and new to scooters. But I have been riding for 35 years :) Mostly heavy touring bikes. And the problem you show in your picture is a well known problem. But I think I have a solution that you can try ;)
My scooter is a Kawasaki J300. And that is a Kymco Downtown with Kawasaki badges. I live in Norway, and scooters are not the most common bikes here. You can only buy Kymco mopeds here, so when I wanted a Kymco Downtown, I had to buy a Kawasaki J300. And then I found this forum and registered. I think this forum is a nice source for information, and I hope I can contribute with information as well when I get into this "scooter-thing" ;D
One thing I have learned over the years is that air pressure is very important on bikes. To low pressure will give you the wear that you show in your picture. I have 3600 km on my scooter now, and my rear wheel is still round and fine. And I do a lot of straight highway with high speed and heavy load of luggage.
In the owners manual it says 33kpi pressure in the rear wheel with full load. I have used 36 kpi. If you look at the side of the tire, you will find a "max load", and thats the pressure you can use to get most milage out of your tires.
The thing is that the worst enemy for the tires is heat. The warmer the tires get, the faster they wear. And they wear most in the middle. If you use higher pressure in your tires you lower the working temp, and therefore get more km out if it.
Eventually the tire will be flat in the middle anyway, if you drive normally. But you will get much more km if you use the max pressure stated at the side of the tire.
I can mention that on my last touring bike, a Kawasaki 1200 Voyager, I got 10K km on a rear tire when I followed Kawasakis recommended tire pressure. I used Metzler tires on that bike. When I talked to Metzler, they said I should use the pressure stated on the tire, and then I got 18K km out of a rear tire.
Just my 2 cents :) Hope this will be useful. And I hope my English is readable ;D
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OK Stig what tires to I get? I am changing the darn thing every 7000km's
We'll perhaps have to agree to disagree about proper two-wheel tire pressures.
Both of the service counter personnel at my Honda mega store motorcycle shop and my local multi-brand motorcycle and scooter shop tell me to use the PSI listed on the scooter/motorcycle sticker and in the owner's manual.
Do NOT, they say, inflate and ride at the max pressure printed on the tire.....whether riding solo or two-up or heavily loaded. That figure is not meant to replace or augment the recommended PSI for the wheel/tire/scooter combo.
At least two things will happen if you over-inflate the tire like that:
1) you will immediately notice a harsher ride
2) you will decrease the tire contact patch & thus alter the designed handling - which you may or may not notice when riding
Solid tires will give you longer mileage, too. But mileage is not the sole purpose of a tire on most any vehicle.....and certainly not on motorcycles or scooters which need to make good and predictable contact across their rounded surface.
Tire and rim sizes are designed specifically for each bike. Stepping outside of manufacturer's recommended PSI changes the tire shape & ride behavior characteristics.
Car tires on a scooter last a long time, too. Their box shape & road contact profile are different than the round shape of a scooter tire. Watch the youtube video with the gopro mounted under a scooter using a car tire. Some folks have no problem using car tires - even after watching what that car tire does on a turn.
To each his own - but I'll stick with trained guys who make their living servicing bikes & scooters.
I'll soon be at 10,000 miles on my pair of Michelin City Grips, running on the PSI in the owner's manual.
Stig
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Beautiful looking bike!
For the Maxxis we talk about 10% more pressure in the rear tire. 33 psi on the sticker versus 36 on the wall of the tire. I don't know how much more km's that will give, but from the picture Nireen999 posted compared to my rear tire at 3600 km it seams that it will give a lot more km's. And 10% more air pressure will not be noticeable or give any dangerous effects. I would say that a tire that is flat in the middle is far more dangerous.
On my Voyager Kawasaki recommended 36 psi in the rear wheel. Metzler said at least 46 psi. I used the same word as Stig when I talked to them and they answered that they had more knowledge about tires than Kawasaki had. They even had it in writing on their website, but I can't find it now. I'll keep looking and post it when I find it.
My experience with the Voyager tires was that I never experienced any drawback when it came to performance or grip. In all kind of weather and road surfaces for over 65K miles. And here we talk about 30% up on recommended pressure.
But everyone must choose what they want to try. I just wanted to tell about what I was recommended, and what's working good for me. ;) Maybe the most important thing is to check the tire pressure often. Many folks drive around with to low pressure most of the time.
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I've got a Michelin Pure Power rear tyre on order. I fancy a bit of French rubber in my life.
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Jalmar, I love your 2 cents!! My book say's 32 psi and my tire itself says 40psi. What do I do?
I expect to get at least 10K km out of a rear tire. If I get more, I see it as a bonus. If I get less, I look for errors... I got 6K km out of the factory rear tire. I changed it because I didn't like it so much. I changed it for a Metzler Feel Free. I think the factory tire could have lasted maybe 8K. Now I have 3K on the Metzler, and it is doing good :)
On the factory tire I used 36 psi pressure. Thats 10% up from what is recommended. On the Metzler I use 39 psi. I have never experienced any change in roadholding with 39 psi, so I think that's OK. After 3K km in all kind of traffic, it holds the profile nice and round.
This is what I do. I am no tire specialist. I just do what Metzler recommended on my touring bikes long ago. And I have used that trick for many years with no problems. ;)
Another thing that often is overlooked is the gauge. Is your pressure gauge correct? I am so lucky that I can get my gauge measured every now and then, so I know that it is correct. I have tested many different gauges, and found that there are many bad ones out there. Up to 25-30% wrong readings on the cheap ones. So maybe you think you have the right pressure, but have to low because of a bad gauge?
Tire shops should have correct gauges, so you can check your own if you check the pressure with your gauge right after they have filled the tire. Gas station gauges are not that good usually. At least here in Norway.
Another thing I do when I get on new tires, is that I measure the tread depth in several places around the tire. I measure where the tread wear indicators are so I'm sure to remember where I measured. After 1K km I measure again in the same places. Then I know how much tread wear it has been in 1K km, and I can calculate how long the tire is going to last. And it is surprising how accurate that has been for my tires. Actually I do this for every 1K km on a tire just for the fun of it. But I am an old geek and love to keep track of things ::)
(This method is not a scientific correct method. Just for fun.)
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This is great. I am going to copy and paste this for my records. I recently had that back tire put on and yesterday I thought gosh I should check the pressure that they put into this tire. It was only at about 23psi! Geeez! I put it up to what the book said 32psi but on the tire itself it say's 40psi.
I expect to get at least 10K km out of a rear tire. If I get more, I see it as a bonus. If I get less, I look for errors... I got 6K km out of the factory rear tire. I changed it because I didn't like it so much. I changed it for a Metzler Feel Free. I think the factory tire could have lasted maybe 8K. Now I have 3K on the Metzler, and it is doing good :)
On the factory tire I used 36 psi pressure. Thats 10% up from what is recommended. On the Metzler I use 39 psi. I have never experienced any change in roadholding with 39 psi, so I think that's OK. After 3K km in all kind of traffic, it holds the profile nice and round.
This is what I do. I am no tire specialist. I just do what Metzler recommended on my touring bikes long ago. And I have used that trick for many years with no problems. ;)
Another thing that often is overlooked is the gauge. Is your pressure gauge correct? I am so lucky that I can get my gauge measured every now and then, so I know that it is correct. I have tested many different gauges, and found that there are many bad ones out there. Up to 25-30% wrong readings on the cheap ones. So maybe you think you have the right pressure, but have to low because of a bad gauge?
Tire shops should have correct gauges, so you can check your own if you check the pressure with your gauge right after they have filled the tire. Gas station gauges are not that good usually. At least here in Norway.
Another thing I do when I get on new tires, is that I measure the tread depth in several places around the tire. I measure where the tread wear indicators are so I'm sure to remember where I measured. After 1K km I measure again in the same places. Then I know how much tread wear it has been in 1K km, and I can calculate how long the tire is going to last. And it is surprising how accurate that has been for my tires. Actually I do this for every 1K km on a tire just for the fun of it. But I am an old geek and love to keep track of things ::)
(This method is not a scientific correct method. Just for fun.)
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The pressure level on the tire sidewall indicates its MAX pressure when cold.
It is not its recommended tire pressure.
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The pressure level on the tire sidewall indicates its MAX pressure when cold.
It is not its recommended tire pressure.
The pressure level on the tire sidewall indicates what pressure you must have in the tire to get max load capacity. Metzler Feel Free rear tire can have a max load of 280 kg at a tire pressure of 38 psi (cold)if I remember correctly. So the pressure indicated at the tire sidewall isn't max pressure the tire can have, but the pressure it must have to deal with max load capacity.
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This is great. I am going to copy and paste this for my records. I recently had that back tire put on and yesterday I thought gosh I should check the pressure that they put into this tire. It was only at about 23psi! Geeez! I put it up to what the book said 32psi but on the tire itself it say's 40psi.
With 23 psi you would soon have a worn tire. Think about all the people that trust the shops and don't see for themselves.
I would have put in 38 psi in your tire, but that's me ;D If you usually drive alone with not much luggage, maybe try 36 psi. That should give you some more km on the tire. :)
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The load capacity is the maximum weight a tyre can safely carry.
It has no relation to the max psi indicator.
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Here is a link for further reading.
http://www.dunlopmotorcycletires.com/care/ (http://www.dunlopmotorcycletires.com/care/)
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The load capacity is the maximum weight a tyre can safely carry.
It has no relation to the max psi indicator.
We don't have a max psi indicator on european tires. I would be very interested to see one if you could please take a photo?
So you say that the tire pressure don't have any relation to the maximum weight a tyre can safely carry?
Here is a picture of what I am talking about (sorry for the bad quality):
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y289/gamlebla/IMG_1547.jpg) (http://s7.photobucket.com/user/gamlebla/media/IMG_1547.jpg.html)
As we see, in this case a Metzler Feel Free, this tire can carry 280 kg (617 LBS) at 260 kpa (38 psi). And that is what Metzler can guarantee. It can't carry 280 kg if you have 10 psi in it.
So this has nothing to do with max tire pressure the tire can have. Maybe tires sold in the US has other text on the tire? I'm very interested in the max psi indicator, if there is printed on the tire.
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Here is a link for further reading.
http://www.dunlopmotorcycletires.com/care/ (http://www.dunlopmotorcycletires.com/care/)
Thank you. That link showes just what I am talking about :)
It says clearly: Maximum loads and the corresponding pressures are indicated on the sidewall of all Dunlop street tires.
And Dunlop says the same thing that I say when it comes to pressure: Keep in mind that hard cornering, passengers, heavy loads and sustained high speeds will require higher pressures (up to that indicated on the sidewall).
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Work it out boy's, work it out :D Thanks everyone!! Helpful to Kat here. Now I go within, sleep on it and I will be guided for sure! Happens all the time.
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Kneeslider, please check items 3 and 8 of your link.
Karl
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Work it out boy's, work it out :D Thanks everyone!! Helpful to Kat here. Now I go within, sleep on it and I will be guided for sure! Happens all the time.
Kat, please continue to follow owner's booklet PSI specifications for single and double riding when inflating your tires.
Also, follow the maximum permissable load carrying WEIGHT which your scooter (frame welds, brakes, axles, steering head bearings, etc.) was designed to handle. That figure will never be above your tire limits.
So, check booklet that came under the seat for: tire PSI, load carrying capacity....that is all you need to know....and maybe stop paying so much for tires!.
You do that -- you'll be safe, scooter will be safe, tires will be safe.
Also, ever'dang bike tire is flat in the middle -- just means you're riding not to impress. Does not mean it is necessarily deadly...if there are some tread sipes remaining for water dispersal.
However, do change 'em if you're doing 75mph in monsoon rains.
It is your $$.
3 tire already, seems too much.
Stig
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What Stig said!
Karl
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Kat, please continue to follow owner's booklet PSI specifications for single and double riding when inflating your tires.
Also, follow the maximum permissable load carrying WEIGHT which your scooter (frame welds, brakes, axles, steering head bearings, etc.) was designed to handle. That figure will never be above your tire limits.
Than why the heck do I have to get new tires so often! 12000 km's and on my third back tire!??? :(
So, check booklet that came under the seat for: tire PSI, load carrying capacity....that is all you need to know....and maybe stop paying so much for tires!.
You do that -- you'll be safe, scooter will be safe, tires will be safe.
Also, ever'dang bike tire is flat in the middle -- just means you're riding not to impress. Does not mean it is necessarily deadly...if there are some tread sipes remaining for water dispersal.
However, do change 'em if you're doing 75mph in monsoon rains.
It is your $$.
3 tire already, seems too much.
Stig
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Well, maybe 4000 miles out of a rear tire on a Downtown is about average.
What do other DT owners report for mileage and best brand of tire?
Some Burgman 400 riders are only going 5000 miles on a rear tire.
I'm at nearly 6000 miles on my Burg400, and nowhere near worn out.
Riding styles differ, i guess.
Stig
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Karl,
See below the two topics as you mentioned.
I still stand by my understanding that there is a max psi and max load to adhere to.
3 - Load-Carrying CapabilitiesTOP
Tires offering different load-carrying capacities are available. Consider carefully the weight of the motorcycle, whether it will carry passengers and the weight of any optional equipment. Remember, the load-carrying capability of the tires is also reduced by underinflation. It is possible to overload a tire even though it is the size specified by the motorcycle manufacturer. Maximum loads and the corresponding pressures are indicated on the sidewall of all Dunlop street tires.
Before riding, the motorcyclist must determine the total weight of luggage, equipment and rider(s) to be added to the motorcycle. Instruct your customers that the total weight of luggage, equipment and rider(s) must never exceed the vehicle load capacity found in the motorcycle owner’s manual.
Instruct your customers not to pull a trailer behind their motorcycle. Trailers may contribute to motorcycle instability, grossly exaggerated tire stresses and overload. Such stresses and overload can cause irreversible damage resulting in sudden tire failure, accident, injury or death. Dunlop does not warrant tires used on motorcycles fitted with trailers.
Sidecars should not be fitted unless approved by the motorcycle manufacturer
8 - Tire Pressures (see also Tire Mounting)TOP
Follow pressure recommendations shown on the Dunlop Motorcycle Tire Application Guide. Contact Dunlop if year and model are not shown on the current guide and the owner’s manual does not list pressure settings for Dunlop tires.
Keep in mind that hard cornering, passengers, heavy loads and sustained high speeds will require higher pressures (up to that indicated on the sidewall).
CHECKING TIRE PRESSURE IS THE MOST IMPORTANT TIRE MAINTENANCE FUNCTION YOU AND YOUR CUSTOMER CAN PERFORM.
For high-speed, fully loaded or dual-riding touring-motorcycle applications, inflate tires to maximum recommended by vehicle manufacturer for Dunlop fitment. Never exceed maximum load indicated on tire sidewall or vehicle capacity load found in owner’s manual, whichever is lower.
Underinflated tires can result in imprecise cornering, higher running temperatures, irregular tread wear, fatigue cracking, overstressing and eventual failure of the tire carcass, or loss of control, which could cause accident, injury or death.
Overinflating tires does not increase load-carrying capacity, but will result in a hard ride and accelerated tire wear in the center of the contact patch.
Advise your customers to check cold tire pressure frequently with a good-quality gauge that holds a reading, and always before extended trips.
Loss of pressure may occur due to worn-out or badly seated valve cores. Check valve cores, and if necessary, tighten for correct seating, or remove and replace them. A metal or hard-plastic valve cap with an inner gasket should be used and installed finger-tight to protect the valve core from dust and moisture and to help maintain a positive air seal.
Loss of pressure may also be caused by tube damage, as well as cracked rubber tube or tubeless valve stem bases. Inspect rim bands, tubes and valves. Replace if damage or cracking is noted.
Repeated loss of inflation pressure may result from undetected tire damage. Visually inspect tires for punctures, cuts, abrasions, cracks, bulges, blisters or knots. It will be necessary to dismount the tire to complete an inspection for internal damage and any need for repair. See the Tire Repair section. Only certain punctures in the tread area may be repaired, and only if no other damage is present.
The appearance of stress cracks in the tread grooves is one indicator of overload and/or underinflation. If you find evidence of tread-groove cracking, you should remove and replace the tire immediately. This damage is permanent and non-repairable.
Tires with non-repairable damage must not be used again (see Tire Repair). Damage caused by impacts, penetrations or continued underinflated/overloaded use is progressive and can result in sudden and complete tire failure and accident, injury or death.
Your customers should always seek expert inspection of the dismounted tire following curb, chuckhole or other impacts, evidence of penetration beyond the tire surface, bulges or low pressure. They should not continue riding on such tires.
Advise your customers to inspect their tires frequently for damage and to always heed warning signs such as vibration, handling instability, rubbing or tire noise that occurs during operation of the motorcycle.
Kneeslider, please check items 3 and 8 of your link.
Karl
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Max load is stated at a specific pressure. You can't expect the tire to deal with the stated weight if you have lower pressure. And you can't (safely) expect the tire to carry more weight by adding more pressure. But this do not state the maximum pressure the tire can stand.
But that's beside the point here. No one has suggested to go over the tires weightlimit or the stated pressure. My suggestion was to try higher pressure, up to the pressure stated on the tire wall. That's a free test to see if you get more milage before the middle of the tire is worn out. That's an old metod to get more milage out of motor bike tires.
Another interesting thing here is the weight limit on the bike itself. Have you calculated that on your bikes? Are you sure that you follow the limits? Because if you are over the limits on the rear tire, you can't use the pressure the producer of the scooter says. You have to do what Dunlop and other tire manufacturer say. You have to put on a tire that can carry the weight and use the pressure stated on the tire wall...
Do the math on your scooters and let us see :)
I have done it on my scooter, and I can't legally drive it with a passenger that weigh more than 38 kg.The max load on the rear axel on my scooter in Norway is 231 kg. The scooter itself weights 123 kg on the rear axel. That gives me 108 kg left. I weigh 98 kg with all gear on. I sit in front of the rear axel, so some of that weight is transfered to the front wheel. Lets say that the rear wheel carry 70 kg. That gives me 38 kg left that I legally can load on the rear wheel. What if my passenger, that sits right over the rear wheel, weigh 70 kg? And myabe I have 20 kg luggage also? Well, then I have 283 kg total on the rear wheel.
This has nothing to do with Nireens problem, but it has everything to do with correct pressure. Most of us carry more weight than what is legal when we ride with passenger. And then we have to use the pressure that stated on the tire.
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Kneeslider is absolutely correct. What's on the sidewall is the max pressure the tire can be safely inflated to. The vehicle's manufacturer's recommendation is a compromise, taking into account weight loading, ride comfort, grip and the speed rating on the tire. You should always go with the recommended pressure and not what is on the sidewall.
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Kneeslider is absolutely correct. What's on the sidewall is the max pressure the tire can be safely inflated to. The vehicle's manufacturer's recommendation is a compromise, taking into account weight loading, ride comfort, grip and the speed rating on the tire. You should always go with the recommended pressure and not what is on the sidewall.
You can safely inflate tires to 25-30% higher pressure than printed on the side wall. But that would not give you any positiv effects. And it would be pointless, because it would be overinflated. And loose most of it's grip and comfort. The shops that mount tires for you often inflate tires to 75-80 psi to seat the beads. No problem.
But let me ask you a question: Look at my calculations above. If I choose to have a passenger on my scooter, I would easily put 280 kg on my rear tire total. The manufacturer says that I can have max 231 kg on my rear tire. So I do something unlegal, but I do it anyway. (And I think that goes for most scooter drivers). My rear tire can carry 280 kg, but at a pressure of 38 psi.
If I follow Kymco, and put 32 psi in my tire, will I have the correct pressure for the actual load on that tire, or will i be under inflated?
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I was going by the reference provided in #3 that said load carrying capability is reduced by underinflation and #8 that hard cornering, passengers, heavy loads and higher speeds require higher pressures. Both seem in opposition to what kneeslider said on the 25th that max load capacity and max pressure are not related. What am I missing?
Karl
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I think we're both correct and incorrect. It's more of both having the corrent answers.
Let me explain and correct my post from before.
Yes there is a max psi for the tire.
Yes there is a max load for the tire.
Yes it is related if you are trying to load out your bike to its max allowed loading using the calculation that Jalmar provided.
No the max loading for the tire isn't related to the tire's max psi. The max loading of the tire is only obtained at the max psi allowed by the tire that you have mounted.
The max loading capacity of the scooter is only related to the tire that is asked to carry that load because as Jalmar mentioned, that max tire load has to be within the weight of the bike's wet weight, rider, pillion and luggage.
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One other thing that hasn't been talked about here much, is heat build up, under different riding conditions. If you have inflated to the max PSI on the sidewall and you are riding high speed, as on an expressway, for extended times, your tire pressure can increase as much as 4 to 5 PSI, using regular air.The tire manufacturer has factored this in when deciding what the max psi should be on the sidewall. As stated before, an under inflated tire will heat up more than a properly inflated tire.. Keeping the vehicle manufacturer's recommended PSI in your tires is all important.
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Boy oh boy all this tire talk. Kat is spinning her LOL
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It is becoming rather tiresome. (Couldnt resist) ;)
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Aren't we the funny one, Mr. Paul Had to re-read it twice, before I caught on. TIRE-some. Hee hee
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It is becoming rather tiresome. (Couldnt resist) ;)
He He He :)
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You lot need to get a grip. That joke was rubberish.
Badoom-tish!
I'm here all week. Try the veal.
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You lot need to get a grip. That joke was rubberish.
Badoom-tish!
I'm here all week. Try the veal.
You get a true laugh out loud on that one Snorvey. Oy!
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Does anyone mix tyre makes front and rear on the DT?
As mentioned previously, I have a new Michelin rear tyre on order (based on the excellent feedback on this website) to be fitted in the coming week or two. I have a nearly new Avon on the front.
I've never had any problems with mixing tyre makes on previous bikes, but that was a good few years ago.
Many thanks in advance.
Snorvey
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Does anyone mix tyre makes front and rear on the DT?
As mentioned previously, I have a new Michelin rear tyre on order (based on the excellent feedback on this website) to be fitted in the coming week or two. I have a nearly new Avon on the front.
Snorvey
I have a Michelin Pilot on the front and Pirelli Diablo on the back. There is no problem with mixing tyres, but the rear will always wear out faster.
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Not worried about the language barrier? !
Might be the first time a Frenchman and an Italian cooperated.
Stig
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Not worried about the language barrier? !
Might be the first time a Frenchman and an Italian cooperated.
Stog
Nah, they're all the best of buddies now. It's us splitter Brits on our little island that are the bad guys.
Just wait until they (inevitably) start fighting with each other again though.....
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OK forget about the tires and look at this! LOL :D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gACLPIk5wCc&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gACLPIk5wCc&feature=youtu.be)
Kat
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New tires in the market for our DT.
PIRELLI’S DIABLO ROSSO.
https://www.pirelli.com/tyres/en-ww/motorcycle/all-tyres/sheet/diablo-rosso-scooter (https://www.pirelli.com/tyres/en-ww/motorcycle/all-tyres/sheet/diablo-rosso-scooter)
Anyone tried them? Pricy though.
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Looking for the price. How much are they?
New tires in the market for our DT.
PIRELLI’S DIABLO ROSSO.
https://www.pirelli.com/tyres/en-ww/motorcycle/all-tyres/sheet/diablo-rosso-scooter (https://www.pirelli.com/tyres/en-ww/motorcycle/all-tyres/sheet/diablo-rosso-scooter)
Anyone tried them? Pricy though.
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Looking for the price. How much are they?
In Malaysia they are about 25% more than the Michelin PP.
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I am in Canada so doubt I can get them!
In Malaysia they are about 25% more than the Michelin PP.
Sent from my HUAWEI VNS-L31 using Tapatalk
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I am in Canada so doubt I can get them!
I would have though over there, you guys would be spoilt with choice.
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My only experience with Pirelli Diablo's was on a M/C. They had excellent grip, even on wet asphalt, due to a softer compound. Glad they are now available for scooters
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There are two versions of the Diablos for the scooter market, the stock version is the Diablo and the new version is the Diablo Rosso.
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Am am about due for another dang tire!! geeez :)
There are two versions of the Diablos for the scooter market, the stock version is the Diablo and the new version is the Diablo Rosso.
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I suppose I hold the record across the board for the LEAST mileage for motorcycle tires for over 20 years & 150,000m on every motorcycle I've ever owned. FJ1200, BMW RS, Burgman650 & now the Downtown300. I usually get 1/3 of typical mileage - and even when I would ride at what I consider conservative riding I might get 1/2 at best. The most I ever got out of ANY tire was 6,000m on an old-school original Pilot Road I on the rear of the FJ. Just picked up the '15 DT in August w/550 miles. Been riding the wheels off of it the past few weeks it's now got 1800 miles on it and this is what the OEM rear Maxxis looks like
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The longer the Maxxis tires just sit around the quicker they wear once they start being used. Had to replace the rear on a new old stock DT300i in about 3500 miles! The DT was a 2013 been sitting unsold at a dealer about 4 years when I got it.
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My Maxxis have 15,000km and looks like the the photo above. It must be the quality of the roads or type of riding.
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My Maxxis have 15,000km and looks like the the photo above. It must be the quality of the roads or type of riding.
It’ll be the way it’s ridden, I’m sure Mouse. I never expect to get more than 5,000 miles from a scooter rear, but then I do buy rubber that favours grip over high mileage.
My most expensive week was on the Isle of Man one TT where I took a tyre on my Triumph Sprint 900 from new to shagged in just 1,500 miles!
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It’ll be the way it’s ridden, from new to shagged in just 1,500 miles!
Ahhh, a fellow hooligan I see ;D ...tire mileage & wear pattern is usually a good indication of whether or not a person would make a good riding buddy. I have some good 20year+ riding buddies at FJowners.com but we live hundreds/thousands of miles away & only meet up twice a year for a week or so at the rallies. 99/100 of my local day-rides I am riding alone - or 2up with my hunny if it's warm enough. She likes to set a pretty swift pace, as well .
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Busted! As my old ex-Police riding companion used to say, it’s called “making progress”.
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well I've done something I thought I'd never do. I ordered the cheapest tire I can find on ebay... a Shinko - for the rear of my DT. For 20 years I've always spent the extra money for Michelins and always replaced in pairs for that 'brand new tire front & rear' feeling. (it does feel good) But hey, desperate times call for desperate measures :) . Admittedly I've never tried a shinko on anything. But I've got a bald back tire and no money, so gonna give it a try. I have 3 bikes to ride but I can't stand having a perfectly good bike sitting around because of a bald tire. Who knows , if this tire does OK for me & doesn't slide out I may end up a Shinko tire guy. wish me luck :D
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Gotta be done sometimes. Just get a good feel for it’s Grip in varied conditions before hanging off it!
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well I've done something I thought I'd never do. I ordered the cheapest tire I can find on ebay... a Shinko - for the rear of my DT. For 20 years I've always spent the extra money for Michelins and always replaced in pairs for that 'brand new tire front & rear' feeling. (it does feel good) But hey, desperate times call for desperate measures :) . Admittedly I've never tried a shinko on anything. But I've got a bald back tire and no money, so gonna give it a try. I have 3 bikes to ride but I can't stand having a perfectly good bike sitting around because of a bald tire. Who knows , if this tire does OK for me & doesn't slide out I may end up a Shinko tire guy. wish me luck :D
So how much was the Shinko?
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So how much was the Shinko?
$51.50 free shipping Shinko SR568
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get a good feel for it’s Grip in varied conditions before hanging off it!
...probably another reason my tire mileage has always sucked - I've never been a 'hanger-offer' - even when at max lean angle wearing the michelin man off the edge of pilot powers I basically never throw a knee out except to correct my balance and/or catch some wind. I'm sure this loads the tires more ?
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Probably and I'm much the same TBH, it was just a figure of speech. As we say this side of the Pond, if it's good enough for Mike the Bike* then it's good enough for me.
(* Brit racer Mike Hailwood famed for his smooth approach to bends, "slow in, fast out" was his motto!)
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..update on Shinko rear tire. THIS IS THE WORST NEW CYCLE TIRE I HAVE EVER MOUNTED!! LOL . The damn thing is out of round bigtime. Makes for an interesting ride :D I hope it's a defect but I ain't gonna get another one to find out.
Back to Michelin.. never lookin back again . theres a video here
https://www.facebook.com/100001062206308/videos/pcb.3853724214672947/3853723398006362/ (https://www.facebook.com/100001062206308/videos/pcb.3853724214672947/3853723398006362/)
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So back to the old adage, if it (the price) looks too good to be true, it probably is”!
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But did you check rim/clean it---lube rim and tire bead? Bead well seated? tire assembly balanced? I use Ride On as balance medium----my experience 65 years and at least 400 bike/scooter tires done by me.
I find of Michelin---Power Pure SC--nice as they wear round life of the tire.
Your tire used to be Yokohama until brand sold.
Run just about any scooter wheel and tire on center stand, you will find some out of round. Use correct tire pressure,too.
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But did you
Yes, yep, yea ;D ..but it's only about my 100th cycle tire change. Tire is junk , surprisingly only took .75oz to balance. could make it round in a tire cutter but would probably take 4oz or more to balance. not worth it, I'll take a refund
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Can you say, "car tire?" The one picture of the rear of my Downtown 300i shows the Achilles 122 steel belt radial, 35 bucks on Amazon. 'Bout 9000 miles on it in that Picture, I think.
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Just got a Pirelli Diablo Rosso for the rear. So far excellent grip and improved cornering.
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Looking good Mouse ;)
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I am going to buy a 165 / 70 14 for my Piaggio B V 350, what gets me thinking is tire says smallest rim should be 5 inches ,my rim is 4 inches wide, did you find any thing with the downtown and what size did you put on it, also tring to get a winter tire in that size, for the soft rubber , if it is available,
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I am going to buy a 165 / 70 14 for my Piaggio B V 350, what gets me thinking is tire says smallest rim should be 5 inches ,my rim is 4 inches wide, did you find any thing with the downtown and what size did you put on it, also tring to get a winter tire in that size, for the soft rubber , if it is available,
I used a 155/80R14 mainly to preserve rolling diameter. This one is actually one inch larger than the standard size scooter tire. The OD is equal to the People GTi300 with the 16" wheels!