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Scooters - 50cc => Agility 50 => Topic started by: Deejays50 on February 07, 2013, 10:54:39 PM

Title: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: Deejays50 on February 07, 2013, 10:54:39 PM
Hey all.

I got this Agility 50 scooter for an attractive price. I know it runs because I've ridden it before. It is said to be bored to 80cc. There is no airbox but just an open filter on the carb.

You should know I am on the East Coast and its very cold (20*F). The scooter just won't start. The only time it will start is if its connected to my high amperage Police Interceptor (Crown Vic) with some serious jumper cables while the car is running. I tried using a fully charged and stored indoors booster pack which is supposed to have 600CCA and it still would get stuck.

It just cranks like its a dead battery. It will do half a rotation of the engine, hit TDC and stop. Something tells me this thing should still start in cold weather.

Now, it appears the previous owner took out the kick start. EVERYTHING. the kickstart lever is missing, as well as the spindle and everything that belongs in the trans. I feel if I can re install the proper kickstart components I might be able to start it at any temp outdoors.

Can someone provide me with some pictures of their scoot's kickstart? Maybe someone has a picture with the belt cover off?

Please help me as I am at a dead-end here.

Thank you in advance!!!
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: JC on February 07, 2013, 11:23:27 PM
The guys here on the forum recommend Stadium Yamaha for parts. They also have a fiche so you can get a visual of the kickstart parts you will need. I'm posting from my phone or I'd post a link.
Hope this helps and good luck!!!
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: Deejays50 on February 07, 2013, 11:58:24 PM
I found it on this website as well but it says its for GY6. Is it the same?

http://www.motopartsmax.com/index.php/main_page/product_info/cPath/21_147/products_id/11133 (http://www.motopartsmax.com/index.php/main_page/product_info/cPath/21_147/products_id/11133)

Anyone else care to chime in about starting issue?
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: blue on February 08, 2013, 01:31:40 AM
Becarefull jumping a scoot with a car or truck battery. its ok with the car turned off but dont do it with the car on. you can blow something. the cold weather is hard on scoots some start ok and some dont.
in the cold weather you need a good strong battery.and also you might wana try turning the idel screw up just a little. and in the winter you dont need a open air box the stock box is best in the winter.
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: Deejays50 on February 08, 2013, 01:34:15 AM
I'll need to buy a stock airbox as well. They didn't include that either. People are careless.... may have been a bad buy. But it ran and drove so I figured "thats a start"

I'll look into the airbox idea and idle screw.
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: blue on February 08, 2013, 04:27:33 AM
Befor throwing to much money in to it give it a compression test that well tell you if it worth puting money in to it, if the test is above 120 you are good to go.......after that do a valve check. look the whole scoot over good carb plug good battery gas filter whatever you can think off good luck...
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: Deejays50 on February 08, 2013, 04:42:28 AM
Befor throwing to much money in to it give it a compression test that well tell you if it worth puting money in to it, if the test is above 120 you are good to go.......after that do a valve check. look the whole scoot over good carb plug good battery gas filter whatever you can think off good luck...

I did a compression test and the number was somewhere around 90. He said its 80cc and "cammed"

I realize this may be low but when I rode it last it had a lot of power. If the compression was indeed low, wouldn't the starter have less trouble turning the motor?
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: streido on February 08, 2013, 09:39:28 AM
Kickstarts on a cold day are no fun usually. I rarely use my kickstart unless my battery is flat or something. Better to look at fixing the electric start problem/starter problem if you can.
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: Deejays50 on February 08, 2013, 03:56:12 PM
Kickstarts on a cold day are no fun usually. I rarely use my kickstart unless my battery is flat or something. Better to look at fixing the electric start problem/starter problem if you can.

Any idea where to start? The starter sounds strong when the spark plug is removed. Is it possible the starter is weak? Or should I just wait until spring?
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: de dee on February 08, 2013, 04:39:08 PM
  When you check compression do it two ways , second time with a shot of oil into  cyl.,, and see what the differance is,
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: de dee on February 08, 2013, 04:48:29 PM
   did you put oil in cyl. and check compresion again, you should get a much higher reading,
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: Deejays50 on February 08, 2013, 05:10:22 PM
   did you put oil in cyl. and check compresion again, you should get a much higher reading,

No it was a dry comp test. I'll spurt some oil in there and try again. I assume it will be much higher.
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: Deejays50 on February 10, 2013, 10:02:05 PM
Alright so I have posted a video of the compression test with a shot of oil in the cylinder, and what the engine sounds like with the issue I'm having.

I think you should know that currently there is no air filter on the carb intake. I'm thinking it may be a good idea to get the stock intake and new filter on there, see how things go, then run an open air filter when it gets hotter outside.

Let me know what you guys think.

http://youtu.be/IWyVB5O84kw (http://youtu.be/IWyVB5O84kw)
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: blue on February 10, 2013, 10:26:00 PM
that just sounds like a week battery. try to jump it with a car battery but keep the car off.........with the car runing you might blow something.your compresion is very good so no worry there.
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: Deejays50 on February 11, 2013, 07:37:21 PM
that just sounds like a week battery. try to jump it with a car battery but keep the car off.........with the car runing you might blow something.your compresion is very good so no worry there.

I'm going to try this with a fully charged lawn and garden battery today (its like 225CCA).

But look at this video I found on youtube... sounds just like mine.

139qmb trouble starting (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CP20wc5yILo#ws)
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: blue on February 12, 2013, 12:06:23 AM
that sounds familiar. take the kick start cover off make sure you have the gasket on and the little o ring that fits over the starter bendix is in place. beleave it or not the gasket has to be on or the elc. starter wont work right if no washer the elc. starter grounds out..if you dont have a washer use rubber washer on the bolds that holds it on. Also check all or air lines going to and from the gas tank they must be tight.the air line going to the tank pusher air in the tank so the gas flow well be good.
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: Deejays50 on February 12, 2013, 12:35:44 AM
that sounds familiar. take the kick start cover off make sure you have the gasket on and the little o ring that fits over the starter bendix is in place. beleave it or not the gasket has to be on or the elc. starter wont work right if no washer the elc. starter grounds out..if you dont have a washer use rubber washer on the bolds that holds it on. Also check all or air lines going to and from the gas tank they must be tight.the air line going to the tank pusher air in the tank so the gas flow well be good.

Can you explain a little more about this washer? Where exactly does it go?
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: blue on February 13, 2013, 12:47:59 AM
Its a big rubber gasket that gos all the way around the kick start cover when you take it off.
if you put the cover on with out it. it well ground out the starter. sounds funny I know but it does..
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: Deejays50 on February 13, 2013, 02:16:47 AM
Its a big rubber gasket that gos all the way around the kick start cover when you take it off.
if you put the cover on with out it. it well ground out the starter. sounds funny I know but it does..

Ah yes this gasket is there.

Since it was a bit warmer today (40f) I was able to get it started and I also did a valve adjustment (in spec)

Still doesn't solve my cold weather bit.
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: MotoRandy123 on February 13, 2013, 12:46:29 PM
I had a huge buffer I got from harbor freight and sold it to a guy. He emailed me a bit later
and told me it wouldn't work when it was cold. Maybe your starter motor is the problem? I'm
not sure what inside the motor could do that? Maybe the springs for the brushes get weak
when cold?
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: Deejays50 on February 13, 2013, 12:48:54 PM
I had a huge buffer I got from harbor freight and sold it to a guy. He emailed me a bit later
and told me it wouldn't work when it was cold. Maybe your starter motor is the problem? I'm
not sure what inside the motor could do that? Maybe the springs for the brushes get weak
when cold?

That would explain that the crazy amperage from the car (while running, shame on me that time) would allow the starter to turn.

Should I just replace it?
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: MotoRandy123 on February 13, 2013, 04:01:33 PM
I would give it a shot if it didn't cost too much...

I've heard of magnets coming loose inside them and once had a shorted one on a car,
it drew 1000 amps and dimmed the tow trucks lights!
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: blue on February 13, 2013, 10:44:23 PM
Ah yes this gasket is there.

Since it was a bit warmer today (40f) I was able to get it started and I also did a valve adjustment (in spec)

Still doesn't solve my cold weather bit.
When starteing a scoot in the cold with a open air filter you well have a problem starting it.
try a box filter when weather is cold. and turn the idle screw down a little. or you cold cover the open filter with something..........
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: Deejays50 on February 13, 2013, 10:56:27 PM
When starteing a scoot in the cold with a open air filter you well have a problem starting it.
try a box filter when weather is cold. and turn the idle screw down a little. or you cold cover the open filter with something..........

She started again today. A bit of difficulty but started! My stock air box is coming tomorrow. Bet that will make things easier.
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: Deejays50 on February 15, 2013, 09:38:34 PM
Put the stock airbox on today. Didn't help the starting too much but since its been warm (almost 47 degrees today) it started very well.

But there is a problem. The engine was bogging terribly at higher RPM. So I removed the outer cover to the airbox and pulled off the filter and it ran normal.

I'm assuming the stock airbox is too restrictive for the bored over 80cc?

What should I do?
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: blue on February 15, 2013, 11:25:47 PM
you can drill holes in the air box. drill the holes like 2 at a time and try the scoot and see how it gos. make sure you drill the holes on the side of the box towards the front try to keep the holes on the side of the box the filter is on. Not behind the filter. I well be doing mine soon.
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: Deejays50 on February 16, 2013, 04:29:44 PM
you can drill holes in the air box. drill the holes like 2 at a time and try the scoot and see how it gos. make sure you drill the holes on the side of the box towards the front try to keep the holes on the side of the box the filter is on. Not behind the filter. I well be doing mine soon.

Funny you mentioned this, I read this somewhere too.

But there is a problem. After removing the front cover there is another layer in there that holds the air filter. If I take the air filter itself out and leave the second layer, the engine STILL cuts out at higher RPM.

To me it seems my only option is no air filter at all, OR an open air filter straight off the carb.
Title: Re: Kickstart setup - Picture Request + start issue
Post by: blue on February 17, 2013, 02:33:18 AM
open air filter is ok . if you feel you are geting to much air cover half or 1/4 of it up with something. to slow the air flow down . give that a shot . and also they make covers for theam to help keep water and rain out. or make one your self from a plastic jar that you can cut to fit.

you may wana go down in the jet size . with box filter....