KymcoForum.com
Scooters - 50cc => Agility 50 => Topic started by: Bradders2125 on December 26, 2012, 08:53:47 PM
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Hi guys,
So all was well in scooterville until it started getting cold and wet. On nice days it will kick start no problem, as soon as its wet and/or slightly cold, I'm lucky if it will start after 10 minutes kicking.
The electric start has been playing up for a while due to the top cable always falling off, but now the tab it pushes onto has snapped off, but there is just enough for it to work if i hold it in the right place. But once the starter is usable it doesn't always engage and sometimes makes a lovely grinding sound. I have to tap the ignition button until i get the right noise.
Any help with those problems would be great.
Aside from needing help with the starting, I'm also putting together a parts list ready to start buying on my next payday, while also trying to find UK based retailers for them, got a couple I've used before.
The list so far is:-
New rollers,
Starter Motor,
Spark Plug,
Fuel Filter,
Oil Sump Plug - mine is damaged but still holding oil.
Thanks
Brads
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befor buying the starter motor check the gears in side the kick start make sure all the teeth are good and clean theam good. It might need a good cleaning if the teeh are missing all you might need is the gears.And if the wires are not staying on you can fix that buy adding a new wire plug.
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As far as parts I know racingplanetusa has all the parts you mentioned. I believe they ship to the UK. Also if you do indeed replace the starter motor, I would suggest buying the heavy duty starter motor if the funds allow it. Especially if you're going to be riding in the cold and wet weather
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befor buying the starter motor check the gears in side the kick start make sure all the teeth are good and clean theam good. It might need a good cleaning if the teeh are missing all you might need is the gears.And if the wires are not staying on you can fix that buy adding a new wire plug.
The connector is the male part on the starter motor, If the teeth are good I could probably solder a wire on the tab and then crimp a male connector onto that.
As far as parts I know racingplanetusa has all the parts you mentioned. I believe they ship to the UK. Also if you do indeed replace the starter motor, I would suggest buying the heavy duty starter motor if the funds allow it. Especially if you're going to be riding in the cold and wet weather
I will take a look on there now and see what it comes to.
Cheers
Brads
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This place has some stock parts http://www.chinesemotorcyclepartsonline.co.uk/bikes_AGILITY50.php (http://www.chinesemotorcyclepartsonline.co.uk/bikes_AGILITY50.php)
Or any kymco/yamaha dealer will be able to get parts but theyrr usually more expensive.
Or ebay or theres loads of uk shops online like pedparts or adrenalin pedstop, or sip in Germany.
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The connector is the male part on the starter motor, If the teeth are good I could probably solder a wire on the tab and then crimp a male connector onto that.
Mine came apart on me and I had to almost rewire the whole scoot. check as many wire parts you can. they do get bad.
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The grinding must be the "bendex" type thing that engages the started gear.
It sits behind the variator and comes out from that side. You could take it out
and grease it (and look to see if any teeth are munched).
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Took her apart and changed spark plug to the original one, which has half the mileage of the newer one. Everything seemed ok, some wear and tear on some parts. Rollers had a small flat spot but seemed in good condition.
How easy is it to remove all the kick start gears from the case, want to check them over but can't get an adequate view while they are attached.
Mine came apart on me and I had to almost rewire the whole scoot. check as many wire parts you can. they do get bad.
My cable has always seemed an inch or 2 short, so over time where its been pushed on again the male part got bent and eventually broke. On the plus side there seems to be plenty of room to solder a piece of cable on, once I've cleaned it and can see metal. Also the splines on the shaft seem a little bent and worn, and there was some black powder around it.
The grinding must be the "bendex" type thing that engages the started gear.
It sits behind the variator and comes out from that side. You could take it out
and grease it (and look to see if any teeth are munched).
I was going to add a dab of grease but then remembered people saying don't put grease near the belt. The teeth looked good.
Thanks
Brads
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There's some tips on getting the kickstarter apart (and back together again) in this thread;
http://www.kymcoforum.com/index.php?topic=8173.0;topicseen (http://www.kymcoforum.com/index.php?topic=8173.0;topicseen)
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You can put a small dab of grease in the hole on the outer case where the bendix goes into. Sounds like maybe the bedix is not always releasing as it should. I take it you do still have the rubber seal fitted between the cvt cover and the case? If not this can affect how the starter works due to the spacing. May even be a bad bendix.
If you get a tin of electrical circuit board cleaner or degreaser and use the small straw attatchement you can normally just use that to clean out the starter gears/kickstart without disassembling it all. Just re-oil it all once its cleaned and before you use it. I normally clean mine out 2-3 times a year and re-grease it.
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As I've got plenty of spare time at the moment I will be able to check, dismantle and reassemble most stuff. The only downside being the short days causing lack of light.
I did notice that some of the bolts are threaded badly and I remember using a thread repair kit on some of the holes. So that could be a reason for it, if the case isn't tight enough.
Brads
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As I've got plenty of spare time at the moment I will be able to check, dismantle and reassemble most stuff. The only downside being the short days causing lack of light.
I did notice that some of the bolts are threaded badly and I remember using a thread repair kit on some of the holes. So that could be a reason for it, if the case isn't tight enough.
Brads
Put some plumers tape on the bolds it well help hold tight.
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On a similar scooter that i once owned (not a Kymco on this occasion) the starter bendix used to get easily funked up, any grease that was on it used to attract all of the belt shavings that were loose under the transmission cover. It caused a problem that is known as "sticky bendix" where the bendix does it job but then gets stuck in the out position so then next time you try to start it it just whines and grinds but doesn't actually do too much else.
The cure is to remove the bendix drive (which on most scooters usually just lifts out when you can get to it under the transmission cover) and blast it clean with WD40 or similar, work the bendix when the WD40 is on it to loosen it all up, and then let it dry completely.
Reassembly is easy and usually I'd not apply any oil as it will get all stuck up again
Hope this helps
Fabio
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(http://www.piese.com.ro/images/glc-bendix-gy6-50-4t-50-80cc-139qmb--baotian--first-bike--kymco--rex-peugeot-vclic--rieju--sachs-4t-1101.jpg)
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So today was a good day.
Soldered a piece of wire onto the starter motor tab, added a male connector to the other end. Popped a dab of grease on the shaft and refitted. Then tried to start and IT WORKED. But I'm not jumping for joy just yet, it was dry outside and not too cold. So I'm going to try it a bit later when the weather hopefully turns sour.
On another note it seems to have lost some power, not accelerating as fast and significant slowing down on an incline, also it doesn't sound as loud and throaty as it did and I can hear some sort of air leak. Replaced the recently removed iridium plug as it looked fine and it seemed to run slightly better although I didn't test ride it.
I've bought some new bolts to replace the damaged ones, hopefully do that tomorrow. Going to cut the old heads off and use the rubber bushes on the new bolts.
I have noticed a tube running from the top of the cylinder and then going under the floor pan. It's loose and the end is flared like it has been attached to something in the past. Is this normal or should it be attached at both ends.
Thanks
Brads
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Well the loose tube is the crank case vent. It should attach to the airbox or intake tube somewhere.
Maybe the open connection is letting air in and upsetting the mixture?
I'd leave the iridium plug in too. They fire a tiny bit easier and last a long time!
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First off Happy New Year. I decided that the three main things I've done today should be continued throughout the year. Looking after the 'ped, kissing girls and drinking Jack. Start as you mean to go on.
Now on to the 'ped, replaced 4 of the bolts, the cover is held on nice and tight now.
Removed the kickstart assembly and checked it, the teeth do look a little worn, which is probably why it grinds and slips. Probably due to trying to kickstart it for 10 minutes at a time, so will probably buy them parts soon.
I was wondering, if the choke has failed would that cause the problem with starting during the cold and wet, but being easier during warmer days.
Brads
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Are you running an open filter? What hose was hanging loose? The small one, like maybe 1cm wide from the top of the case on the cover you remove to do the timing? If it is then thats fine, mines been hanging free since i fitted a k&n.
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Yes if the choke doesn't work it will start OK when warm but be problematic when cold...
Though some have disabled it and don't seem to have any problems?
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Are you running an open filter? What hose was hanging loose? The small one, like maybe 1cm wide from the top of the case on the cover you remove to do the timing? If it is then thats fine, mines been hanging free since i fitted a k&n.
Yeah, I got an open filter.
Yes if the choke doesn't work it will start OK when warm but be problematic when cold...
Though some have disabled it and don't seem to have any problems?
I'll give it a go when the weather stops raining.
Brads
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If its a filter with a foam core the moisture in the air when cold or damp can block them up, even my k&n gets a little damp from dew etc. Also the weather will affect the jetting, some days it will be sluggish cos it'll run a little rich when damp outside normally if the jetting is correct on dry days. Thats how mine is but its better than having it perfect in the damp and lean in the dry.
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Had to leave it last night, started after a few minutes, went out then wouldn't start again. Definitely need to replace the kick start mechanism, it just feels like it's slipping and grinding now. That will be the first thing I order on Wednesday.
Has anybody had any experience with the £50 stainless exhausts on eBay. I know it probably won't be great for the price, but mines looking rusty so want to replace it, just hesitant with cheap parts unless someone else has tried them.
Brads
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Is there a way of testing the choke to see if it works or not?
Brads
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Well it should read 10 ohms or so when cool. It works by heating wax to push and
pull a needle into a circuit in the carb. If you remove it from the carb and apply
power the needle should move after 2 - 3 minutes. I'm not sure which way it
moves....
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I received some of the parts I need so, tonight, under moon light i'm going to attempt to fit them. If it still won't start at least it's in a safe place.
If it fails still, would it be worth trying some of that easy start spray I've seen.
Just want to bring it the 3.5 miles home so I can look properly.
Brads
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Bring some garlic to keep the werewolves away! And if all else fails 3.5 miles is not too bad to push a fifty...
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I decided to wait until sunrise to look at it. hopefully it warms up, if not I don't have much hope of starting it.
I'm starting to worry its going to become a money pit at the minute.
Brads
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Today was a good day. Using sods law to my advantage, I bought a return bus ticket, found a charger for my battery. Took the battery out, charged it, put it back and finally. Turn, turn, turn, FIRE. It lives.
Now I have have it home, I can start sorting the faults. One slight fault I noticed on the way home, the front brake is on, all the time slightly. I can just about hit 30 on the speedo.
Brads
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what size jet do you have in you need 85 or better if you have open filter. and in bad weather place a cover over the filter. and did you ever replace the dive poss with a smooth one.
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what size jet do you have in you need 85 or better if you have open filter. and in bad weather place a cover over the filter. and did you ever replace the dive poss with a smooth one.
I believe I have a #92 jet. My air filter has a screw on cover. It has got the smooth boss.
When I last removed the bendix it seemed ok and moved freely.
Brads
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If it were me i would refit the stock airbox and fit an #82 jet in before i did anything else. Until it runs good then there is zero point trying to tune or mod it in any way apart from just a de-restrict. Once it runs perfect you can then tune in the jetting to use the open filter.
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My current setup was working fine, until it got cold and had starting trouble. The weather has started warming up a little lately so hopefully will be able to do some more soon.
I was going to look at my caliper and clean it up, but none of the Allen bolts will undo. Is there any way to help them undo, if not I've seen some 2nd hand ones on ebay.
Brads
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Try spray some penetrating fluid on the bolts from the rear and let it soak in for a while. Mine where tight but did come loose with a large allen key. Sometimes if its real tight and siezed if you try actually tightening it a touch then it frees it up and you can loosen them then.
I run an open filter all year and have not had any issues. Did you make a cover for it? Mine came with a cover but it was no good on wetdays, the rain still got in and then the scoot just bogged down and died. Maybe thats your problem? ( not sure if its been mentioned already cos i havent went back to read thro the whole post again). I made up a good cover from a 2L plastic Coke bottle, been fine ever since.
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Hopefully if it is a damp filter, it will dry out soon.
I'll try the bolts again, hopefully be able to sort that out.
Brads
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when I have allen key wrench or bolts to loosen , I use a impack screw drill ,. it has low torque, and will not break bolts, just a idea!