KymcoForum.com
Scooters - 50cc => Agility 50 => Topic started by: Kenho21 on June 14, 2012, 01:07:24 AM
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So today I took my CVT apart to give it a good cleaning and put it back together then went for a ride. About halfway around the block I heard a horrible noise, shut it off and wheeled it back home and took the CVT cover off immediately. Below are one or two pics of what I found.
Does the damage look horrible or should I still be good? When I put the variator and stuff back on the teeth all still line up perfectly with almost no play when I rock the drive plate, or whatever it's called back and forth. Seems to me like it just kinda scuffed the metal real good and didn't take too much metal with it, but let me know what you guy's think.
I did realize when I was putting the whole variator assembly back on and went to put the belt back on over the boss there was almost no slack and had to squeeze the belt down into the clutch to slide it back on, it was a real struggle. Then when I slid the plate on that goes on after the belt (the one with the fan thing that goes over it, then the washer and bolt) it didn't seem like it was sitting flush. It seemed like the belt was in the way and stopped it from tightening down onto the boss drive. I just tightened it as much as possible and hoped it pushed the belt out of the way a little and sat flush and snug. It didn't and this is what happened.
So my real question is why did this happen? Why couldn't I tighten the plate down all the way, why was the belt in the way?
I'm really freaking out so I would appreciate if my fellow Kymco pals would look this over and give me their diagnosis. ;)
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Another
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and another...
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...the damage is not extreme...i've seen MUCH worse...you will probably be okay, bro...
..clean away all the shavings!!!
..i always squeeze my clutch, while pushing the belt inward toward its center, FIRST!, before putting clutch on its shaft, thus creating belt slack at the variator's drive center...
..in other words, i install clutch and belt at same time, with variator already in place..
..what happened to you was, you tightened the variator nut to the belt's width...
..always rotate your drive face assembly a cpl-3 times during the tightening of the nut, making sure there is no "wobble"..
..tighten lightly at first, until wobble is gone, then torque it down real good....
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...annnd, i just remembered, belts can be installed in an a50 without removing clutch...
..in that case, just squeeze the clutch and install belt deep into the pulleys, then you will have much clearance at the variator's drive centre...
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Thanks a lot Word! I knew I could count on ya!
I took it all apart cuz I wanted to sand the clutch bell and all the surfaces down because I was having a little slippage
I was sh**tin bricks for a while, I had a feeling I was overreacting but feared for the worst I guess.
I'll put her back together (correctly) tomorrow and be screaming down the road!
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..wecc'm!..
;D
..dang..i've overlooked things before...when assembling...
..forgot the drive face once..closed the cvt case, fired the engine....well, tried to fire the engine..
:P.
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It wouldn't hurt to get a shim/speed kit. You can move the plate out into clean teeth, and it can't hurt your performance
http://www.racingplanetusa.com/variator-control-shims-naraku-speedup-gy6kymco-p-21863-1.html?cPath=2_122_586&sessID=222d9adf2af151e5416a9778e94238f5 (http://www.racingplanetusa.com/variator-control-shims-naraku-speedup-gy6kymco-p-21863-1.html?cPath=2_122_586&sessID=222d9adf2af151e5416a9778e94238f5) It will survive.
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..i got a set of those, but with a boss as well..i experiment a lot...
;)
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I have some coming just to make the free shipping, and for cases just as this!
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I've never seen those before, hopefully I can find some in the US. But I'll definitely get some. They just act as sort or an extension of the drive boss and sit up against it?
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And yea, it perturbs me that, that's one of the first things I ever did when I got the scooter was install rollers and did it correctly and since then I've torn the whole engine apart and installed a BBK but somehow messed this up the second time round... but breakin stuff is usually a part of fix in stuff hahaha
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What are the proper steps for putting the clutch, variator and belt back on?
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I always put the outer variator on then hand tighten the nut up as far as i can with a wrench. Then i pinch the belt together in the middle of the cvt to draw it into the rear pulley and give me belt slack. This means it sits higher up the variator and wont get jammed when i torque up the variator nut. Once its all tightened up i spin the belt by hand to make sure its free and can move and isnt jammed at the boss or anywhere.
Like Z and Word said already, if the nut torques up and its all tight etc then it should be fine, the spline damave looks minimal in the photos to me.
Lesson learned i guess, at least it wasnt a costly one. I did almost the same a few weeks ago when i didnt fit a washer and my variator nut came loose after 200yds, that was a close call too but fine in the end.
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Thanks guys, will do that today for sure.
Those 12v electric impacts are kinda scary, it feels like they has about as such force as my six year old sister with steel toes on.
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..i like my Craftsman 19.2v....
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Oh boy... You shoulda waited for the 19.3v... They are soooo much better.
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My 12v is fine when i run it off a car battery charger, cant remember the newtons it makes but its well enough, off my scoot battery it wont work tho.
Its powerfull enough that i stripped my clutch nut not too long ago. Now i give it less "bangs" when i tighten it. :)
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Does the 12v run better when you connect or directly to your car battery?
I was gonna do it yesterday but I always feel better about draining the battery through the cigarette lighter rather than directly from the battery for some reason.
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Does the 12v run better when you connect or directly to your car battery?
I was gonna do it yesterday but I always feel better about draining the battery through the cigarette lighter rather than directly from the battery for some reason.
I dont ever use my car battery, i use a charger to power it, something like this one (http://www.homebase.co.uk/wcsstore/homebase/images/212233HBO111111M.jpg)
Just have the wires joined and taped up permanently so i can plug it into the mains and run it off a socket in my garage, works well for me and saves having to get the car out etc.
The cigarette lighter or battery that you use should use the same power off the battery anyway so if you do it either way it shouldnt make a difference to how much it drains it.
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Running thru the lighter is looking for trouble anyway. There are a but load of TINY wires the lighter is connected thru. It is fairly easy to overheat the circuit before blowing a fuse. Most NEW cars have the lighter circuit run thru the cars computer too. Don't want to over heat that!
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+1 z
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Slapped her back together (correctly) and took her a good 20 miles or so today, running great! Thanks for your guys help with that one, thought I was a goner for a while. Still gonna get some shims though just to be safe.
It still feels like its slipping a little though, but I got 2500km on the stock belt, I think it's just time for a new one. Us it mainly slips with with half throttle or more. All the mods im assuming cause a slightly worn belt to become more apparent.
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..i have a weather-proof 12v "lighter" type auxillary socket wired to nina's battery...charges cell phones, gps etc...
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Yea from now on I'll be attaching its directly to the battery to, good point Zombie.
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Still gonna get some shims though just to be safe.
..keep in mind, that adding shims will change your variator action...
..aannnd, give your new setup/cleaning some miles to seat in before you jump to changing anything else...
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Right on word, the slipping was happening beforehand too though, so it's makin me think something is goin on down there. 2500km is about the average for a stock belt isn't it?
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..i got 32,000 kms on my original bando belt before it broke..
..actually, that was when i found my way to this forum...
..unless!!..you been modding and straining that bando really hard, it's most like just a baby...
...got some calipers??..measure its width...if it's still @ 17.5-18mm, and doesnt look frayed or cracked and sh**, then it's prolly got quite a bit of use left..
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I'll check it out, could be my jetting too then I guess I'm still getting that right, waiting for some in the mail as we speak.
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..kenho, refresh my memory on your scoot's setup..would y'?
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72cc kit, foam filter, 5.5g rollers, 105 main, about to install 45 pilot, NCY exhaust
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Also, gonne install Malossi Mutlivar soon
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..do you not run lean with a 105 main feeding 72cc?
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I get a little popping at WOT, but I thought it was cuz I'm too rich. You think a 105 would be running lean?
Ashamed to say I've never done a plug chop on it
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..well, you should check your plugs, for sure..but you will benefit greatly by replacing the oem variator...
..a tuned malossi would really blow your mind...
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..i run a 101-102 with an open filter and 50cc and a modded oem exhaust...
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Hmm, plug chops tomorrow then. Makes sense I guess cuz I put a 95 in and it wouldn't even move, but I though a 105 would be more than big enough. I'll have to get a few more jets and have my neighbor make some holes in em for me.
What about using a drill bit to open the jets up more, think they are accurate enough and it's possible to get a straight enough hole?
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..i drill frequently...the jet i'm running in my 50cc s9 issa drilled keihin 95 to a 125...
..accuracy of the size is not the matter...it's what your scoot needs for proper mix that is more important...
..one thing that i will throw out there, you may need to raise your needle for best mid throttle performance, with the kit, filter and pipe...
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You use the solder and welding tip cleaner method?
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..well, the solder is only used if you need to re-drill a hole thats too big...
..but i use pin drill bits to open jets...they are for torch tip cleaning as well, but are actual twist-drill bit..
..also gotta have a good set of dial or digital calipers, so you have good reference points when deciding how much to drill...
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Right on word, the slipping was happening beforehand too though, so it's makin me think something is goin on down there. 2500km is about the average for a stock belt isn't it?
My stock oroginal Bando has between 10,000-13,000 km on it and is only now approaching the tollerance limit of 16.5mm. I swapped it out avrs ago but still keep it as an emergency belt in case im stuck for one. It still works ok, not frayed, couple of tiny hairline cracks starting but its def usable in an emergency if i need one whike i wait for a new one being delivered.
Those stock Bandos must be made from some strong sh**, some of my replacements only lasted a few months.
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Bando has been making belts for ever. They are the best in my opinion for OEM type/hp engines. I just use the kevlar type for HP reasons.
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I've heard (from this forum I believe) that the kevlars can make quite a mess sometimes when they finally go on you. I was thinking about getting one though. Have you ever had any bad experiences with one Zombie?
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..kevlar belts turn into chunks an a whole lot of "puff", when they break...
..makes a helluva mess...
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Every Kevlar belt I bought! They are tougher than the aluminum/steel parts in the cvt so they actually can PIT the metal by tearing out micrometer thin slices. When they do go (which is realistically soon) they scatter debris everywhere inside the cvt. Used as a daily ride, and OEM trim kevlar is a recipe for short coming disaster. Used for ripping around, and 10+hp, inspected almost daily kevlar grips better than anything else available. Expect 1,000 miles to be max on Kev. where OEM may last 13-15,000 miles. Do the math...