KymcoForum.com
Scooters - 50cc => People 50 => Topic started by: obz on May 23, 2012, 03:04:02 AM
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Hey Guys,
So I just purchased a 2005 People 50 2t. It's a great little scooter but I bought it knowing it has an issue. The scooter tops out at about 20 MPH. The engine runs strong and it sounds maxed out when it's doing the 20 but it won't get faster than that. Now I know they're not made to go 500 MPH, but it should be going around 35-40, right? Well tonight I pulled appart the CVT and put in new rollers and a new belt. Absolutely nothing. Same top speed (if not slightly slower since I put in slightly lighter rollers) and I got nothin'. The clutch looked good. The pads looked good. No significant wear anywhere that I could see. I have no idea where to go from here. I don't know if it's the clutch or the variator. It would seem to me that it's not getting up into the higher "gear" range which is why it's maxing out at 20. So I put my problem to the Kymco Gods and ask what I should do??
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Welcome to the forum!
Check the width of the drive belt first. Factory width is 18mm. Should be at least 17mm wide. New belts, depending on brand, are known to measure differently from their indicated size. Could be the belt is too short also.
What's the(indicated) size of the belt you bought? What is the weight of the new rollers?
Is the variator boss(bushing the variator rides on) completely smooth or does it have a shoulder on it? Even with the restricted boss it should do more than 20. Look for any reason the variator can't move in and out freely
You've got an awesome scooter. Let us know what you find.
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Thanks for the info. I checked the drive belt size and compared it to the stock belt that I pulled off and they're identical in size and width. Makes me think I didn't need to swap it. I put in 7.5 gram rollers with the hope that I'd get a better acceleration, but I got nothin'. I don't think there was a shoulder on the variator boss, but I could be wrong. I'll have to take a look. I read about a couple of other people having a similar problem and they tracked it down to their brakes. I pulled my front caliper off this morning and drove it around but I didn't change a thing. I'm also noticing that after swapping out the belt and rollers, the scooter almost "coughs" at high RPMs. It doesn't happen every time, but it does happen none-the-less. Another guy I read about found that he had a problem with the auto-choke on his carb and replaced it, then everything was good. I know a lot about motorcycles (I've built them) but this scooter has me completely puzzled. I don't want to just start replacing parts only to find out it has nothing do with the issue. ???
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If you don't already have the manual here it is. Go ahead and download it to your computer.
Kymco People 50 EN (http://www.scribd.com/doc/18774028/Kymco-People-50-EN#)
Directions for testing the auto-bystarter(auto choke) are in the manual.
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Thanks man! I just rode my buddies Hyosung 50cc and that thing pulls WAY harder than mine does. I'm wondering if I've got a combination of problems. Luckily the owner of provoscooter.com is one of my buddies just up the road so if I need parts I know where to find them. :) I'm going to take it apart again tonight and see what else I can find. I'm going to try cleaning the carb and check the compression just to be sure its running like it should.
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So last night I pulled apart everything. After doing some additional reading I thought it might be worth checking the compression. I pulled the spark plug and it was completely gunked up with stuff (never a good sign). I threw in the compression gauge and I'm getting just below 90 PSI. :o So looks like a rebuild is in order. I'm going to order a BBK and throw it on there. If I'm rebuilding it, I might as well go the distance, right?
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Absolutely!
You may want to go ahead and invest in a new carburetor and exhaust to go along with it. Send Zombie a PM. He might be able to find your parts at a discount. If not, he'll know the best place to order from.
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Pssssst. Buddy! Wanna try some good stuff? Stick with the good stuff for sure.
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I got the exhaust (Tecnigas RS II) but not a carb. Is the carb not a 16mm? Shouldn't that be plenty with the correct jet?
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I think stock is 17.5mm
You might drive yourself nuts trying to find jets for it
You can run with it but it's better to move up to a 19mm. Malossi(Del orto) and Arreche make nice carb kits.
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Well I got everything on including the exhaust. I've got to find jets now. We'll see how that goes...
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Hey Guys,
So I just purchased a 2005 People 50 2t. It's a great little scooter but I bought it knowing it has an issue. The scooter tops out at about 20 MPH. The engine runs strong and it sounds maxed out when it's doing the 20 but it won't get faster than that. Now I know they're not made to go 500 MPH, but it should be going around 35-40, right? Well tonight I pulled appart the CVT and put in new rollers and a new belt. Absolutely nothing. Same top speed (if not slightly slower since I put in slightly lighter rollers) and I got nothin'. The clutch looked good. The pads looked good. No significant wear anywhere that I could see. I have no idea where to go from here. I don't know if it's the clutch or the variator. It would seem to me that it's not getting up into the higher "gear" range which is why it's maxing out at 20. So I put my problem to the Kymco Gods and ask what I should do??
you said, you put in lighter weights? no man put in couple of grams heavier weights, that will give you bit more speed.
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I think stock is 17.5mm
You might drive yourself nuts trying to find jets for it
You can run with it but it's better to move up to a 19mm. Malossi(Del orto) and Arreche make nice carb kits.
Can I use a tap and die kit to open the hole a little?
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No
You can open the stock jet up with a combination very small drill bits and torch tip cleaners. Solder will fill the hole again if you go to far. You'd be surprised how many people use this method. It does work.
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There is not enough meat left to re tap the threads. Torch tip cleaners are great. 4-7bucks at hardware/home centers. Solder/flux is almost free.
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Well I ended up buying a new carb instead. With the restricted boss and CDI still restricted I can get up to 50 MPH. I'm waiting for the new BBK to break in before I take off the restriction on the CDI. The smooth boss should be here in a couple of days. We'll see what I get out of it with the new boss.
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Nice.
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Okay, rather than start another thread I thought I'd ask it in here. So everything is running good. No issues after installing the kit/carb/exhaust/intake. Now, I have to get it passed for inspection and for some reason the rear tail light stays on. It doesn't matter if I grab the brake or not, it stays on. I'm guessing something's wrong with the switch? It's not just the tail light either, I don't have to pull the brake to start the scooter (which is a nice feature actually). I've done some searching and I found only 1 thread that had a similar issue though there never seemed to be an answer. Ideas?
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I forget how the goofy wiring works there. It is a three wire set up on the right brake, and two on the left.
The left/right switch can be bought for 5 bucks on Ebay. http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=gy6+brake+switch&_sacat=0 (http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=gy6+brake+switch&_sacat=0)
There are two types for the right side. One is a tube type, and the other is a roughly square shape box.
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I forget how the goofy wiring works there. It is a three wire set up on the right brake, and two on the left.
The left/right switch can be bought for 5 bucks on Ebay. http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=gy6+brake+switch&_sacat=0 (http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=gy6+brake+switch&_sacat=0)
There are two types for the right side. One is a tube type, and the other is a roughly square shape box.
Rockin! Thanks for the help. I traced it down to a faulty brake switch on the right side (master cylinder side). The little tip that pushes it in is broken off (making it act like it's always all the way out). Ordered the part off of e-bay and should have it in a few days!
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Okay, so I've run into another problem. When I get to WOT (keep in mind this is still regulated by the CDI) it runs fine but kind of "barbles." My buddy thinks it's because it's running up against the rev-limiter which is causing the problem. This could very well be, but I'm not 100% sure. When I'm slowing down and I try to give the scooter gas I get nothing, and I mean absolutely nothing. It won't pick back up until the RPMS drop down to probably around 3000 or so, then all the sudden I get my power back. Thoughts? Is it my main jet? I pulled my plug and it's nice and brown (slightly dark perhaps) so I don't think I'm running lean, but perhaps I am.
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What size is your main jet now?
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It's a 105. I'm in Utah and above 4500 feet. I can definately get a bigger jet. I've got a 19mm carb so I thought I would be safe with a 105. On the way home I noticed that when the wind was blowing on the scooter it bogged horribly, even up and speed it would just lose power. The intake on it is just a wide open sponge. You think I should up my jet size?
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Higher Altitude = Less Air...Less Air = Less Fuel
I'm around 1000 ft above sea level and I'm running jets between 95 and 100 with similar mods.
It won't hurt to try a larger jet but I think you're too rich right now.
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I've got a 95 that I can through in. Let me try that.
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Okay, so I've run into another problem. When I get to WOT (keep in mind this is still regulated by the CDI) it runs fine but kind of "barbles." My buddy thinks it's because it's running up against the rev-limiter which is causing the problem. This could very well be, but I'm not 100% sure. When I'm slowing down and I try to give the scooter gas I get nothing, and I mean absolutely nothing. It won't pick back up until the RPMS drop down to probably around 3000 or so, then all the sudden I get my power back. Thoughts? Is it my main jet? I pulled my plug and it's nice and brown (slightly dark perhaps) so I don't think I'm running lean, but perhaps I am.
There are a few things in here. First the barble MAY be the rev limiter. Try going down hill so there is no load on the engine. At 9,000 rpm the engine should cut in/out skipping every other beat. Once you fall below 9k it should return to normal.
How many turns out is your idle mix screw? And which side of the carb is it on. The air box side or the engine side.I am thinking your no power on take off may be due to flooding at low throttle/slide positions.
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Both the Air Mix screw and idle screw are on the airbox side. I'm not sure how many turns the idle screw is out, though I can check. What you describe on the barble is exactly what I hear. Going down hill it does the exact same thing and I swear refuses to go faster. Because I'm in the mountains I drove it down a pretty decent grade and it just wasn't having it. Going up the hill it ran awesome with no barble at 45.
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That is your rev limiter/re stricter. It is important to know how your mix screw is set to determine the jet needed
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My mix screw was way out. I read it's supposed to be out about 1 1/2 turns. It was probably out 4 or 5.
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Okay, screwed it all the way back in and then unscrewed it a turn and a half. No more stutter... at least for now... I'm going to ride it some more and I'll keep everyone posted. Oh the joys of tuning. :-\
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You may figure this out but you turn the Air screw until you get the highest rpm's . Lower the rpm's back to normal idle using the Idle set screw, and re do the mix screw until you have the BEST idle. That is the setting. From THERE count how many turns out it is.
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Thanks Zombie. Okay everything seems to be running way better. Bottom seems good, top seems good. Middle range, not-so-much. If I try and rev at about 1/2 throttle when slowing down it still bogs. I know that's the needle, but is it running to lean or rich? Should I try the thinner needle for this carb? You think that would help?
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Indeed needles do make a HUGE difference. I just bought a ten pack from Treatland. My jetting was fine top, and bottom but 1/2 still bogged. I tried a tiny tipped thin needle, and it got worse. I then used the fattest needle, and like magic all is well in 1/2 throttle land.
I would suggest an assortment.
Glad to hear you have the rest sorting out. It feels good to get it right. Right before something else F's up! ;)
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...was the belt a oem "Bando" belt?
..with oem cvt, a 729-18-28 will work nicely..
..you must remove the drive boss restriction, if it's there..
..does it sound like it's revving really high??
..if so, then someone may have de-restricted the cdi, and not the drive boss, which is very baad....
..check out this thread...
"http://www.kymcoforum.com/index.php?topic=6133.30"
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I haven't done any derestrictions yet. Both the CDI and drive boss are still restricted. The drive boss is on its way. No it doesn't sound like the RPMs are super high. If anything it seems like it's revving low. Definately not upwards of 10K RPM's.
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The best thing you can do from here is to install a 1500 contra spring. That will increase your rpm's, and give an all around better feel to the bike. I would do that along with the boss, and cdi de-restrict
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What RPM band should this 70cc kit be running in? Doesn't the CDI restrict to 8000 or so RPMs? I know my CBR red lines at about 11K RPMs but I wouldn't think these little scooters are the same are they?
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What kit is it? Most GOOD kits run 10k no problem. The cdi indeed will taper off power after 9k on the people. It's a timing thing but with a Performance kit you can spin upwards of 12k. I have a Corsa that I have to throttle back after my tach tops out. I still don't have all the parts installed to really see how far it will rev.
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I have the Malossi 70cc kit. Another completly unrelated question, should I be mixing my gas rather than using the oil pump?
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Absolutely
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The Malossi sport makes its power between 7500, and 8500 rpm. With just the kit, and a mid pipe the injector is fine. I ran the same set up for 3 years until the bore was so worn it started snapping piston skirts. So the pump or 50:1/35:1 premix is fine. Your cdi will be good as well unless you do some porting on the jug to raise the power band.
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I've got a 19mm carb and after market pipe, I don't mind mixing it. I suppose you just unhook the throttle cable from the oil pump and just mix it, right?
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You Have to remove the pump, and replace it with a milled plug, or grind off the gear on the pump, and reinstall it with a new O ring. Otherwise the pump will spin till it burns up it's seals
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I need to do that. My pump still spins dry.
What happens, eventually it starts pulling in air?
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Yes. The internal seal fails, and next the piston.
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..next is the 6 week wait for replacement bits...
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Damn
I need to get on that
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I would put it up high on the list. I just got 2 new plugs from Daywot on ebay. 20 bucks plus shipping. He owed me from three years ago.
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Will do
I'll need a fuel safe o-ring huh?
Or
Where would I find a plug?
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Daywot ebay
http://www.ebay.com/itm/OIL-INJECTOR-PLUG-PRE-MIX-ELITE-DIO-SA50-SR50-SK50-SYM-DD50-JOLIE-KYMCO-ZX-EZ-/261016169321?pt=Race_Car_Parts&hash=item3cc5c6ab69&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/OIL-INJECTOR-PLUG-PRE-MIX-ELITE-DIO-SA50-SR50-SK50-SYM-DD50-JOLIE-KYMCO-ZX-EZ-/261016169321?pt=Race_Car_Parts&hash=item3cc5c6ab69&vxp=mtr)
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I need it for my people. Will that work on it?
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Hell... I don't know... SLINGER!!! Try looking up the pumps for both zx, and people on Stadium Yamaha. If they are the same part # you're in.
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..uhhmm..whuh?..uhmmm..oh, sorry...
..taking a nap...
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Man... Kids. Is it the same plug?
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I'm on it
Sorry I should have thought of that myself :)
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Oil pump zx50 part # 15100-GR1-9500
Oil pump People 50 2t part # 15100-GKAK-950
Guess not
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If you guys know of anywhere to get a plug, that would be awesome. I suppose to help with oil I could add a small amout to the gas tank, right (an oz or less)?
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..i simply removed the shaft from my 01 ppl oil pump...installed pump without shaft...
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If you guys know of anywhere to get a plug, that would be awesome. I suppose to help with oil I could add a small amout to the gas tank, right (an oz or less)?
Zombie posted a link obz
...
I'll just have to dig in there and see what I find. Hopefully I can just remove the shaft like you did word.
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Let us know what you find Peters. I'd be interested in doing the same thing.
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Will do
Remember, the ppl's engine is way different than the ZX's
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Do you have a ZX or a People? I've got a People.
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Both :)
2010 people with BBK and a stock ZX
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Took the shaft off the pump and reinstalled the pump. O-ring was good. Shaft pulls right out of the pump. Very simple. I already had the inlet and vacuum lines plugged
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You will be way better off in the long run.
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Took the shaft off the pump and reinstalled the pump. O-ring was good. Shaft pulls right out of the pump. Very simple. I already had the inlet and vacuum lines plugged
Did you do that to your people or your ZX?
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The People
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I'm going to give it a go this weekend. Seems like a better move. Is the o-ring plastic or something else? Since my People is a 2005 I worry that it's going to be all tore up...
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Standard rubber O ring from any auto parts store. About .30 cents.
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Thanks Zombie. Looks like I know what I'll be doing this weekend.
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Am I cool to leave the oil pump still hooked up without the gear (I mean hooked up to the oil tank)?
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(I mean hooked up to the oil tank)?
..NO!!...plug all them tubes and ports and stuff!!...tightly!!!
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I agree. Even non spinning the works will get fouled up.
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...i plugged and tucked the tubing...
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Why do you have the cable hooked up? Get a one piece...Maybe when yours wears out... (no jinx)
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I still had my cable hooked up for a long time. Left it disconnected this time. I love the lighter throttle action now.
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Why do you have the cable hooked up? Get a one piece...Maybe when yours wears out... (no jinx)
..that's why...no where to put it!...lol..
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Just remove it from the splitter. It does lighten the feel of the throttle.
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What did you guys use to plug the tubes?
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..fine-thread, tight fitting screws, and hose clamps.