KymcoForum.com
Scooters - 50cc => Super 8 => Topic started by: moz76 on May 02, 2012, 02:34:08 PM
-
hi all , first im a scooter virgin and new to the site so hello ... right im a total novice , i bought the super 8 50 4t for my son and now both headlights dont work , indicators and side lights ,brake lights are fine but no full beam ,.. i have no idea how to take thing apart on a scooter so please help , now the lights worked previously but after being in storage for a few months leading upto his cbt they have stopped working ... any ideas welcome ..thanks...
-
quick update , i had a look in where the battery is housed and their are three fuses , 1 with black wire and two with red , one of the red wired ones (7amp) had blown , i changed this and started bike , still no lights , checked the fuse and it had blown again ... stumped...
-
Sounds like a short. Start chasing wires...
-
Yes, a short.
-
Follow that wire. You will find a short. To make life easy take off all the plastics. You may find a few things to clean up at the same time. Maybe even a mouse nest. They chew on wire like its food
-
thanks very much for the replies folks , i thought it would be some sort of short but it surprised me that it was blowing the fuses even when the keys werent in the ignition , anyway ill have a look and post when i find a cure ...cheers....
-
owft ... took off the plastics ..nightmare lol... had a good look around the wires and cant see anything.. i think im going to have to get someone a little more clued up to have a look ....
-
Don't serve the beer till After its fixed. You may wind up with "wheelie bars".
Try unpluging connectors until the fuses stop blowing (one at a time). That may narrow it down for you.
-
right guys , ive found whats blowing the fuses its a black box , says on it kymco tyc-d401 ... its got a big crack down the middle , would this be the cause of my lights issue ? anyone who can tell me what it is please let me know ty ...
-
im having a nightmare lol , the cdi in my sond bike has a four and two pin plug with a wire coming off the box itself , i have looked everywhere and cant find another cdi (not even a picture) with that wire coming from the box ... i cintacted a garage and they said they can sell me one without the wire but surely it must be used for something or it wouldnt be there ... help .. haha
-
Is this an S8 two stroke?
-
What country is this in?
-
hi zombie , its a s8 4t , and in the uk ... must say thanks for the help , i only blew two fuses before i found the cdi was faulty , and that was because you had told me to unplug one at a time ... cheers mate ...you couldnt see the crack because of the rubber holder over it ...any more help would be great ...thanks..
-
this is a couple of pictures of it :)
-
http://www.ebay.com/itm/CDI-power-kit-ignition-unit-unrestricted-Super-8-50c-Kymco-4-stroke-NARAKU-16886-/180859490240?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a1c10cfc0 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/CDI-power-kit-ignition-unit-unrestricted-Super-8-50c-Kymco-4-stroke-NARAKU-16886-/180859490240?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a1c10cfc0)
That is the only one I could find. Yours is a DC fired cdi so it is less common. Perhaps Ebay UK or another local shop like SIP Scooter shop
-
cheers for getting back to me zombie , it seems i have been mis-informed ..or have i .. after lots of internet research i have found that this is the light control assy (control box) it was situated behind the headlights , i also have another box beside the battery and i assume that is the cdi ... im having a nightmare with this , its been a holiday here in scotland so kymco suppliers have been shut but should be open again tomorrow so i will post when i find out what they say :) fingers crossed ...
-
I had the same issue with the light. Went out and replace the voltage regulator in the front with a new one from dealer. This did nothing. I tore the scoot apart and could find no short anywhere. I finally wired the lights directly to the battery with a small switch mounted at my left knee so I can turn them on and off as I please.
I also added bright 5w LEDs in place of the 10watt running/park lights that are also inside the headlight lens area. I use those instead of the headlights during the day as running lights. They are nearly as bright as my headlights and use 1/7th of the battery drain.
This solved my issue with my battery not charging enough to start my 2011 Super 8.
-
YEP! CDI is near the battery, and the light module is near the lights...
-
thanks again for the replies folks , i contacted kymco uk today and the part is a headlight control relay , approx £60 to buy , interesting reading that you had a similar experience and had to re-wire direct to lights and install a switch , if this doesnt work i may have to go down that route ...thanks ..
-
I would MUCH prefer direct wiring. Those control boxes are junk!
-
guys i cant thank you enough for taking the time to reply to me :) , im seriously thinking of direct wiring instead of using the box , if you have any links to how this is done or any pictures of it id be very greatful as would alot of others i bet because there is very little info on the net about it , i plugged the broken box back in today and it blew the fuse immediately and also melted it a little more ..dont know why as i didnt have the ignition on ... i will order a new one at some point tomorrow or friday but ill wait til i see if you have any more info for me .. thanks again :)
-
Unless you raise the idle, when you direct wire, you're going to be supplying more power to the headlight than the scooter can generate to keep the battery charged.
You'll also need to wire it through the ignition or a switch, so that the lights aren't on all the time.
Check your local laws though, because a lot of laws require the headlights to be on when the scooter/motorcycle is running.
Also, even if you do raise the idle, you'll be using more fuel and creating more heat. AND, if you don't have high rpm springs on the clutch, your scooter is going to want to run away at idle.
-
Can you post up a Pict. of the wiring to the relay? If you get a good shot I think I can figure an easy re-wire for you. The ZX has the same issue with the headlight drawing more than the stator supplies but with a good battery you only have the issue at stop lights, and such. Replacing all the other running lights with LED's really helps too.
I'm thinking a few "pig tail" jumpers will end the issue. combined with a new 3 dollar Bosch style relay. You DO need some type of key on relay as apparently the 12v there is Not switched.
-
right guys i had to bite the bullet and buy the part , i wont have it delivered for a few days , my biggest fear is i plug it in and it gets fried or something , how can i check my headlight circuit hasnt got a short that will fry it , ill remind you of how i got to this stage , the bikes lights all worked , my son parked it up for a few weeks , he put a trickle charger on it , we went back to start it it started no problems but the headlights had stopped working , i noticed that one of the 7amp fuses in next to the battery had blown , i removed parts and replaced fuses until they stopped blowing , i ended up with the l.c.u i never noticed it was cracked because of the rubber cover over it , once removed the bike stopped blowing the fuses , when i plugged it back in it blew the fuse and blistered the plastic housing next to the crack .. with the new part enroute at a now cost of £70 you can understand why i am apprehensive ;) everytime i call them the price goes up a little haha, do you think im being paranoid and it should simply be a plug in and away you go , or am i rite to be cautious ...either way thanks for all the info folks...
-
Pluu out the bulbs, and test for a short to ground with an Ohm Meter. If the wires feeding the light read open or no ground you are fine. If not... The chase is on.
-
hi again folks , firstly this is a picture i stole to show you the wiring, the plugs connect to the light control unit , the four pin plug in the picture is a feed for the lights through the relay the two pin plug is a positive and negative , my sons bikes two pin plug is showing as live through the multimeter all the time even without the ignition on , surely cant be right ... i cant find a wiring diagram anywhere for the scoot , i also checked it with a circuit light and its defintely live ... very strange , i busted open the old l.c.u and its internal circuit board was burnt ... any ideas .. ive checked wires and cant find a short , everything seems to work as it should but i dont want to plug in new l.c.u til ive figured out if this is supposed to be like this ...thanks..
-
Judging from the Pict the black wire with the bullet connector is the Ignition on trigger for the box. Constant 12 volts is showing off the battery. That is a GOOD thing in your case. Try turning on your key to verify the Ign. on trigger, and I can tell you how to wire in a 3 dollar relay to replace all the expensive Kymco BS
-
hi , coming from the scooter the plug with the red and green wires to it is the positive and negative , both of these on my sons bike are showing constant live ,12.78 v.. , it shows exactly the same when the ignition is on but rises when the scooter is started , the black box beside the wiring in the picture is the exact same box as ours and as far as my research has gone the wire with the bullet head is a direct link to the cdi , the cdi supposedly sends a pulse to the l.c.u through this box and varies volts depending on how high you are revving or if you pull up at lights it drops the current so that your headlights arent drawing 12 v , the other wires you see in the picture (the ones that are bridged) these i think are a direct current to the headlights , the site i stole that picture off gave the bridged wires as a solution to the headlight issue but im not sure just bridging wires is whats best for the rest of the wiring loom , i spoke with some people who own bikes and they said the direct constant 12v current to the l.c.u is right and that there is some sort of switch inside the box , it makes sense i suppose because the battery is never drained , id be more interested to hear someone who is more used to this sort of system to find out your views , and or if you think you could sort out some sort of relay system to save me a few quid lol ...thanks zombie and everyone else for your patience but if we can solve it im sure it will help alot of other people , if you google this problem there are alot of people with the same problem ...thanks..
-
http://scootergrisen.dk/scooterhjemmeside/download/super8_eldiagram.pdf (http://scootergrisen.dk/scooterhjemmeside/download/super8_eldiagram.pdf)
-
Ok then... The black /red is out. It is the same as the kill switch in the bars set. You will need to locate the wire that supplies =12V out when your key is turned on. Since the Bosch relays are rated at 30amps you will need TWO of them. One for each light. You will make a "pig tail on your 12v switched to allow you to connect to pole #85 on both relays. Pole 86 will attach to the green wire on the 2 pin connector from the old light box. When you turn on the key you will hear the relay click on.
Now pole 30 will go to the other wire from the 2 pin connecter. (+12v) You need to make another pig tail to connect to both relays.
One of the pairs of wires on the 4 pin connector goes to low beam, and one goes to high beam.
You want the low beam to go to the pole on the relay that shows +12v (87-87a) when you turn on the key.
The High beam will go to the only left over pole.
The whole job should take under an hour. The relays can be bought for as low a 3 bucks each on line or as much as 40 bucks at an auto store.
http://compare.ebay.com/like/320873078785?var=lv<yp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&var=sbar&_lwgsi=y&cbt=y (http://compare.ebay.com/like/320873078785?var=lv<yp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&var=sbar&_lwgsi=y&cbt=y)
This is the safest way to work around the issue with the volt controller. Your lights will dim at idle but ALL scoots do that anyway
-
zombie i cannot thank you enough .... ive learned so much in the short time my son has owned this bike , and im pretty sure ill have a whole lot of other things to learn before it goes ... thanks again ..
-
I did omit one issue... The high low switch... The way I suggested you will have low when the scoot is off, and High when you turn the key on.
Forget the ignition onto the relays. Send the ign. on to a THIRD relay. The +12v constant will be triggered from this one to the light relays. That way when you turn on the key it will light the lows. Your High beam switch will go to where I suggested the original ign on the light relays. It is one more relay but still the safest way to re wire their dooms day lighting circuit. These relays draw milliamps to activate so their is no excess load from the new relays.
-
Very helpful topic!
Got the same problem.
I'm stuck with one of the first steps.
"You will need to locate the wire that supplies =12V out when your key is turned on"
Got two wires that are 12V after turning the key on. One is going to the voltage controller, the other is coming straight from the key / wire.
When i connect this wire to pole #85 and the green tot pole #86 the fuse snaps....something goes wrong. Anyone a idea?
-
Very helpful topic!
Got the same problem.
I'm stuck with one of the first steps.
"You will need to locate the wire that supplies =12V out when your key is turned on"
Got two wires that are 12V after turning the key on. One is going to the voltage controller, the other is coming straight from the key / wire.
When i connect this wire to pole #85 and the green tot pole #86 the fuse snaps....something goes wrong. Anyone a idea?
can you put a picture or a draw with the connectial of cables in to the relays? make a draw a simple draw and wxplain thanks... srry for my bad english.... i„m an outlander
-
having my s8 4t for 2 years now
and have the problem since day one
everything i learned from internet is that my s8 is a different electrical system from the scootergrisin made the mod
so there are different s8 europe , asia and us version maybe..
and the lights work perferctly fine without battery it doesnt go off .
my s8 headlight goes off after 2-3 seconds on low beam
but the problem is not present on high beam it keeps them on
so the solution direct wiring or no battery and kick starting every damn time :p
-
I remember these old posts, and understand why there are issues w/ scooter lights.
I completely understand the issues, and recommend LED replacement bulbs for everything in a 50cc. I can draw a chart for rewiring BUT not now. I'm F'd up
Re-post this tomorrow to remind me PLEASE.
Peace, Love, and Happiness
G. Love & Special Sauce - Peace, Love and Happiness (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0ixo5K2aTk#ws)
-
zombie sometimes you piss me off :)))))
i have led everywhere
led on speedometer , led on plates , position light on led
but the problem is still there
the cdi gets broken after 1.5-2 years of use
if you change the cdi you'll get the lights back
direct wiring sounds danger
so kick starting my super 8 still working and lights back for sure without my battery
-
Two years later, and I realized I never said You're Welcome. You are Welcome sir!
I did omit one issue... The high low switch... The way I suggested you will have low when the scoot is off, and High when you turn the key on.
Forget the ignition onto the relays. Send the ign. on to a THIRD relay. The +12v constant will be triggered from this one to the light relays. That way when you turn on the key it will light the lows. Your High beam switch will go to where I suggested the original ign on the light relays. It is one more relay but still the safest way to re wire their dooms day lighting circuit. These relays draw milliamps to activate so their is no excess load from the new relays.
-
Ok. I'll try. What you are calling a CDI I think is really the Light Module. The CDI is not connected to the lights at all. The Stator is.
Start w/ the S8 4T. There is a light module that I have no idea what it does because I never needed to know. I assume it is a rectifier but that don't matter.
To make your headlights come on w/ the engine you MUST have all leds, and electronic flasher relays installed first. The power, from the key switch can be extended to the HIGH BEAM BULB ONLY. Unplug everything else that connects to the bulbs except the ONE green wire, and add the new power from the key switch. Add yourself a 5 amp in line fuse, and you are done. The stator, and key switch can both handle the 35 amp bulb pluss the 6-7 peak using the blinkers, and running lights. YOU MUST HAVE ALL LEDS PERIOD
S8 2t is exactly the same. Only difference is the stator is a DC stator. There are more complicated ways to do this by adding a rectifier to the output of the AC stator, and using a relay to interrupt the current or adding a second regulator to the DC stator but the key switch is easiest, and will work fine.
Otherwise clean the headlight switches w/ PB Blaster (NOT CONTACT CLEANER) and replace the Light Control module in a 4t, or the stator in a 2t, and live with it.
CHEAP CHINA SCOOTERS! Don't get amped up over them. If it breaks your stones to deal with then you should have bought a Piaggio!
But I... You don't' understand I... They shouldn't be like...
No buts, I do understand. They are like... cheap.
-
@zombie you are a smart
but kymco doesnt sound to be cheap while s8 costs 1999$
most piaggios are in that price category im talking about 50-125cc
i had piaggio and i miss it so much never had any problem :s , but it was ugly as f*ck
got my beautiful s8 and being a friend with my mechanic aswell...
-
By Cheap I mean Plastic, and aluminum everything, and wiring that belongs in flashlights.
Kymco = cheap
http://www.apriliausa.com/motorcycles/sr-50-factory.html (http://www.apriliausa.com/motorcycles/sr-50-factory.html) = quality (still slow tho)