KymcoForum.com
General => Technical | How To => Topic started by: KymcoManc on April 07, 2012, 07:39:18 AM
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Hi all,
I've a Kymco Agility 50cc 4 stroke 2007 standard silver scooter 9900mls. I've used it 4-5 days a week for the past 6 months or so & its been fantastic. Last week on traveling it started a slight yo-yo-ing, ie: power/drive on off on off on off. I used it like this for 3 days because it was usable & still got me to where I wanted to go, though it was annoying.
After this & as I didn't need to use it for afew days I set about having a look to see what the problem was.
I thought it maybe some dirt in the fuel as I did let the tank run low just afew weeks ago. Checked fuel lines & all seem ok.
I then thought maybe some dirt has got into the carburettor. I've taken off, inspected & cleaned where I could though not completely stripped, due to fear of not reasembling properly again. I've also blown out all hoses leading to & from the carburettor.
On a fully charged battery, I tried to start & the engine is turning but it is not firing up :-(
I remove the spark plug, it was all black, so I clean/lightly sandpaper it/clean again...I start again & its the same, not firing up.
I need my little runaround scooter back on the road a.s.a.p because its currently my only means of transport.
Can anyone help please, it would be most appreciated.
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I'd probably give the fuel filter a look over. A swap out could be all you need to get back on the road.
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I'd probably give the fuel filter a look over. A swap out could be all you need to get back on the road.
Also, if you think the spark plug is that bad, just change it along with the fuel filter.
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check it's getting a spark, if weak could be a stator problem
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What does the fuel filter look like, is it the small white bottle thingy inbetween the fuel tank & carburretor? If so I have blown through it & is clear, also on trying to start fuel runs through it fine.
If the stator, where is it located & how much are they to replace?
Thank you
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i was being a little too vague there, all the electrical firing system needs to be checked condenser, cdi and lastly stator. If the scoot was charging the battery ok before then stator should be ok.
There should be other threads on here about checking voltage/ resistance of the cdi and condenser.
Taiwan scooter Assasins have most parts
Good Luck K
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Check the inlet manifold isnt cracked, leaking or torn where the clamp goes round it to connect it to the carb.
Check the air hose to the filter isnt blocked and the filter is clean, if the plug was that black its running way rich so maybe its not getting enough air.
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...i swear, it sounds like something in the carb...
..you will have to disassemble the carb to be able to clean jets...
...do you know how to verify that you're getting spark at the plug?
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...i swear, it sounds like something in the carb...
..you will have to disassemble the carb to be able to clean jets...
...do you know how to verify that you're getting spark at the plug?
I'd like to comment on the poster saying it could be the air inlet, this is clear & there is no leakage.
I feel yes it maybe the carb & will remove again & strip. I didn't clean the jets 1st time around due to the worry of not putting back correctly, so the question I need to ask is; how do I get to the jets on the carb? What do they look like? & are there any springs etc I need to be carefull of on removing?
No I don't know how to check for a spark, help required!
Thank you
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No I don't know how to check for a spark, help required!
Pull off the spark plug wire, remove the plug with the plug socket, put the plug back onto the wire and turn over the engine while you hold the metal screwed end of the plug onto the frame where it will get an earth. You should see a small spark between the plug gap if its all working.
To get to jets take off the bottom of the carb by removing the 3 screws underneath. Give it a search on youtube "change carb jet gy6" and you should see some vids on it to better show it.
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Pull off the spark plug wire, remove the plug with the plug socket, put the plug back onto the wire and turn over the engine while you hold the metal screwed end of the plug onto the frame where it will get an earth. You should see a small spark between the plug gap if its all working.
To get to jets take off the bottom of the carb by removing the 3 screws underneath. Give it a search on youtube "change carb jet gy6" and you should see some vids on it to better show it.
Thank you for this information, I will be doing this tomorrow. If the jets are dirty etc, will I be able to see it? & is it a case of just cleaning & replacing?
On the other hand, what if theres no spark at the plug? Where do I go from there?
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I have only took out my main jet so cant say for the others but on the main if you take it out you can blow thro it if it looks blocked or use a needle or a pin if it looks really blocked.
Make sure you have a good earth on the plug when testing it otherwise it wont spark. If theres no spark see how the plug connector looks where it joins the wire, sometimes they break at the join. The plug connector just screws into the wire by twisting it on. Otherwise it couod be the coil or any number of other things.
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I have only took out my main jet so cant say for the others but on the main if you take it out you can blow thro it if it looks blocked or use a needle or a pin if it looks really blocked.
Make sure you have a good earth on the plug when testing it otherwise it wont spark. If theres no spark see how the plug connector looks where it joins the wire, sometimes they break at the join. The plug connector just screws into the wire by twisting it on. Otherwise it couod be the coil or any number of other things.
Brilliant, thanks again. I will update once i've carried out this.
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http://m.youtube.com/index?desktop_uri=%2F&gl=GB#/watch?v=9bSHLeSw1fE (http://m.youtube.com/index?desktop_uri=%2F&gl=GB#/watch?v=9bSHLeSw1fE)
This video is what i'm gonna use today to clean my carb jets, looks easy enough. Will post later once carried out.
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Ok, today i've checked for spark at plug & there is :-)
Removed air filter eliment & box, cleaned eliment, box had alot of oily fuel in, so drained & washed.
Removed carburetor, stripped & cleaned jets etc. The smaller jet was clogged up. Replaced all & put all back on scooter.
Started up & after 6/7 starts it fired up :-)
Went for a ride & all fantastic & crisp on exeleration, like a new engine :-)
Leave it for afew hours, start again & nothing :-(
Perhaps the jet has got clogged up again (maybe theres more crud in the carb etc) Anyway i've put the battery on charge & will give another go tomorrow morning.
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You could be onto something with the jets getting dirty and blocked. Where did the crud come from and is there more? Probably.
You didnt use any sealant or anything on the carb when you took the bottom off did u? Only asking cos a long time ago i used gasket sealant on mine and next time i opened up the carb base the float chamber had bits of the sealant in it.
Did you check your fuel filter?
The oily mix in the airbox is normal too btw.
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Also, how does the plug look? Normal, lean or rich?
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I've just tried again on a fully charged battery & its the same pre carb clean, so it (the jets) must be clogged with crud again :-(
No I didn't use any sealant, just cleaned/blew out etc & replaced. The plug is alittle rich, would this cause a problem? If so how can I change this?
I'm just thinking the jets (or 1 of them) must be clogged again, but after cleaning i've no idea why & were from.
The only thing I know is after blowing the jets/cleaning etc the scooter ran fine, until I tried again after afew hours of being stood still.
Looks like I can only remove, inspect & clean again tomorrow? (Its too late in the evening now)
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I couldn't wait till tomorrow because its frustrating me.
Ok, i've removed the plug again & its very black & slightly wet, is this too rich?
Its obviously not right because i've cleaned it, checked for spark again (all good) put it back in & bike started 1st time. I've turned it off & re started many 4-5 times (all ok) & now left it running on tickover for the past 30 mins, its ticked over fine with no misfires or yo yo-ing etc & are now gonna switch it off. Fingers crossed it'll start in the morning, if not what do I do from here.
It must now only be the plug running a very black & slightly wet. What makes a plug so, is it just a case of changing the plug?
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It's too rich, things to check, mixture screw, float level ???
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You may have a bad tank of gas . I would drain and rinse the tank , refill with fresh gas and add 1 oz.per gal seafoam , and replace the spark plug . Good luck .
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You may have a bad tank of gas . I would drain and rinse the tank , refill with fresh gas and add 1 oz.per gal seafoam , and replace the spark plug . Good luck .
Thanks to all posts, everyone has been a great help & its great to see the common bond of the US & UK on here :-)
Today's jobs.
1) order new spark plug, done √
2) remove existing plug, clean/replace
3) remove fuel tank, drain/clean/new fuel
4) start engine, warm it up till auto choke has done its job (revs drop), adjust idle speed & mixture screw on carb.
When plug arrives, tomrrow or day after (i hope)
5) replace plug (whats the gap settings, anyone know?)
6) Check idle speed/mixture screw adjust again
7) start up engine & hope i've covered everything to make my scoot run better than ever :-)
P.s on another note, if i get more air flow into the air box by means of extending/making bigger the existing hose, will this be of benefit? I understand i will just have to check/adjust the idle/mixture thats all?
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Jobs 1, 2, 3 & 4 done √
& running well. :-)
Jobs 5, 6 & 7 still to do (when plug arrives)
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If you increase the air flow you could see improved performance but you will have to rejet your carburator , running lean can cause overheating and engine damage . Good luck .
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If you increase the air flow you could see improved performance but you will have to rejet your carburator , running lean can cause overheating and engine damage . Good luck .
Thanks.
Well after doing jobs 1-4 earlier today then leaving the scooter to run great for a good while, it idled so sweet. NOW would you believe, I want to go on it & it won't start :-( :-(. Same again turning, but not firing.
I'm so frustrated with it now. I've taken out the plug & its still black & wet, ive cleaned & replaced, yet it still won't start. Tomorrow the new plug should arrive & so I feel all I can do is fit it & see.
I've read that once you turn off the engine, the auto choke dumps fuel ready for the next start. If this is correct? Could this be the problem? If so, can I do without the auto choke by removing it from the carb or simply un plugging its connecter?
Again any help is appreciated.
P.s once I fit the new plug & it starts, maybe a proper ride out to get fresh air in the air box will help? Instead of just starting & running in the garage on its centre stand?
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It sounds more like an intermittent electrical problem , maybe the stator or just the plug connector . I hope you find it soon .
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If the sparkplug gets black with carbon, then the engine is running too rich.
Several possibilities, but this may be due to the auto-choke staying on, either it may be broken or the temperature sensor
that controls it may be broken.
But you say that the idle speed reduces when the engine gets up to temperature, so some or all of that may be ok.
Another source to make the fuel mixture too rich is a very dirty air filter.
As long as you can clean the jets and it works, that points to trash in the gasoline as far as the starting problem.
So, the rich fuel mixture may be a seperate problem from the starting.
Best of luck,
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He also stated that the plug was wet , that means the gas is not igniting . That is why I suspect electrical problems .
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I'm so pleased that i've got people on here helping me & with all your input it gives me confidence that i'll be able to sort it out :-)
What bugd me is that after doing jobs 1-4 yesterday morning, it started easily, I was able to let it warm up (atleast 10 mins) i was then able to adjust the idle speed & air/fuel mixture, then let it run for 20-30 mins & it ran so so sweet at revs just over cut off but enough so it wasn't chugging.
you'll understand I was so chuffed with myself.
Later in the day i came to start it & it wouldn't, turning over fine but not firing.
I remove plug to find it black & WET, I dry/clean it & replace but still no firing up :-(
Maybe the plug is knackered? I will know when I fit the new one.
Maybe other problems as you say on here? Its a dilemma but I won't be beaten :-). I can't be its my only transport currently & I don't have the funds to take it for repair at the scooter shop.
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The plug would be black and wet after the second time you tried when it didnt start, this would just be from the engine turning over and thriwing fuel into the chamber. Had it started the fuel wouldve burned off and the plug would be dry. Since it didnt fire up the fuel would just be pumping into the chamber and sitting there making the plug wet.
Did you check the spark plug connector end and spark plug cable? Could be a loose connection or damaged cable or bad end that makes sometimes but doesnt other times. What size main jet is in it? Is it derestricted? Any othet mods on it we should know about?
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The scooter is 100% standard.
No I've not checked the cables, so now thats a job to do.
At the top end of the spark plug is an alloy grub screw thing that screw onto the top of the plug, what does this do, what if its loose or missing?
I ask this because its missing from the plug, though it must have been that way in the time i've had the scooter in trouble free ridding.
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New plug arrived today so fitted it & checked cables, which all seem fine.
Started up on the button, warmed up then adjusted idle speed & fuel/air mix.
Left for afew hours then started again on the button so went on 2x 30 min rides this evening & ALL seems good with engine smooth as :-)
I'll try tomorrow & if ok it looks like i've finally cracked it, fingers crossed.
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Like juice said earlier in the tnread it couldve been an electrical fault, maybe a broken wire or bad electrical connection and with you moving the wiring about it may have remade the circuit.
Or its been one of the things you tried.
Or something else :D
Hope its solved, let us know how it goes after the next few days.
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I've done 3 seperate 20 min rides on it today & so far so good. It runnng very smooth, even at a low rpm idle, no dips or surges in power etc. Its also starting 1st time on the button. If it remains the same over the next few days then i'm thinking all is well, then its afew cheap but worthwhile jobs in the derestriction area :-)
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Fingers crossed for ya :)
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Hurray, fantastic, brilliant, i'm very hsppy that i've sorted the problem/s & with the last 3 days the little agility is buzzing along great.
Wy i'm so happy is that i've carried out the work/checks myself which has given me confidence to tackle anything in the future, also it given me great satisfaction in being persistant & patient in working through the issues etc.
All is great & a BIG thanks to each & every one of you who posted your thoughts, views etc etc. I wouldn't of been able to do it without you :-)
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Sounds like you got it, hopefully it stays good. No youre a proper scooter mechanic :D
I was the same when i 1st got mine, scared to touch anything on it myself, now i do everything i can. I think the only time i wpuld pay a garage would be after i had exhausted every possible thing i could myself now. Saved you a fortune too on labour costs.
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Sounds like you got it, hopefully it stays good. No youre a proper scooter mechanic :D
I was the same when i 1st got mine, scared to touch anything on it myself, now i do everything i can. I think the only time i wpuld pay a garage would be after i had exhausted every possible thing i could myself now. Saved you a fortune too on labour costs.
Thats how I feel.
Well its cost me a spark plug & a tank of fuel = £10
The rest has been my time of which I don't mind as i've learn't alot in the process.
I can't imagine how much the bill would of been if I took it to a garage/dealer to sort out.
Perhaps they would of said I needed more parts? Perhaps they would of had to do the trial & error thing (like me) in finding the problem/s.
I don't know, any ideas?
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Oh im sure they would have charged you over £100 anyway. Usually they start at one end and replace an item at a time with new until they fix it, fine if they get the faulty part 1st but not so fine if they dont. Once they fit a part then its yours, even if it doesmt fix it and proves that your part was ok, they still charge you for it. Most of the repair was labour on your scoot so i expect the bill would run to at least 2-4hrs labour, most charge at least £40-£60/hr just for labour so even going on the lowest time and price it would be near £100 plus parts.
See if you can find a good local independent small bike repair shop for the future if you ever need it, i have a good guy locally who often tells you how to fix it yourself, he tells ypu exactly what he would do 1st so you can go home and check yourself for free, hes a decent guy, one of the few mechanics i trust.
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Well i'm very pleased with myself, that kinda money is certainly better in my pocket atm :-)
I'm gonna order a new drive belt (the hevier duty one) ready for the future mods soon, then take it from there. Mines slipping when setting off & top speed.
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Just be careful to check any new belt you buy to be sure its the same. Even better get the make and numbet off your old belt if poss and get an exact copy of it, its prob a Bando belt. No 2 manufacturers seem to be the same on belt sizes so a 729mm long belt can be anywhere from 716mm- 730+mm , i know, crazy right?
Loads of us have bought new belts only to find they are not the same size as stock despite the dimensions being listed as the same, i got at least 3-4 brand new belts in my garage that should fit but dont ???
This belt 100% fits, i know because i got one 2wks ago and am running it now http://www.chinesemotorcyclepartsonline.co.uk/partno_DB059.php (http://www.chinesemotorcyclepartsonline.co.uk/partno_DB059.php)
Or like i said get the info off the belt you have in right now and buy that.
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Thanks for that, the one I was looking at is on eBay, search; Kymco Agility HQ 50cc belt
The one at £13.95, they also do a cheaper standard one at £8.95, both plus postage.
What do you think?
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You dont want to know what i think........ ;D
As for belts tho......
Up to you, like i say tho just check the length against the one you remove. If it looks the same length and runs similair then it will be fine. Usually the width and pitch is fine, it seems to ne the length which causes manufacturers problems for some weird reason.
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...there are some cheap Gates Powerlink belts out there, at local shops for sale, that I'm not completely sure aren't knock-offs...
..i've bought them on many occasions...
..they wear quickly, and usually fall short of printed "spec"..
..to be sure, order a "Gates Premium Powerlink"...even the printing on the belt is of better quality...true!!
..i'm sold on'm....
;D
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I can't believe it, since the £6.00 a UK gallon (don't know in $) I put in the empty tank last weekend my Agility is still running after already doing 9O miles :-) which is more than previously.
I can hear theres still some fuel in there so it looks like around 100mpg is achievable, but i'll tank up today. I couldn't be happier after resolving my starting/running problem/s.
Will be fitting the new belt today which I hope will resolve the setting off & top speed slip.
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Go!go!go!.... ;D
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so it looks like around 100mpg is achievable
...not on mines!...lmao!!...
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I can hear theres still some fuel in there so it looks like around 100mpg is achievable, but i'll tank up today.
i tried the how many miles can i get outta a tank..didnt go well..it was on the red and basically saying "im empty" and i thought it would survive another trip to work.....but it didnt ::) i ended up running outta fuel and having to push my bike up a hill then another mile and a half to work. i was late that day.....oooops.
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...last time mines ran out, i had to suck the tube to get th bowl primed...it was just that damned dry....