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General => General Discussion => Topic started by: zombie on February 12, 2012, 07:02:10 PM
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E10 & Phase Separation (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rO3x5o0W7-M#)
This will address most of the winter fuel problems we all have. Except for two people that are immune.
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Except for two people that are immune having no issues.
:)
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Germany expects another night with temperatures down to -20°C in the Alp villages. Last week we had down to -29°C in the lowlands, -31°C in the Alp villages and -38°C in the mountains itself.
We have all kind of Ethanol fuel, even many E85 petrol stations since 2005.
But Sweden is even much more fond of Ethanol and started much earlier with it.
You know where Sweden is?
It reaches up to N69°, Fairbanks/Alaska is "only" N65°. -40°C is cold for scandinavian villages, but not a sensation.
Maybe Florida is much colder than Sweden. Then of course your coasts are full of ice - like the German (and naturally Sweden) coasts now.
But I think, that a fuel which works well in Sweden, will work in the comparative warm Germany too.
It did work during the wars (Germany has no oil-wells) and I don't see any reason why it suddenly shouldn't work.
Sorry, I'm only a layperson from a 3rd world country. Our fellow countrymen don't know about engines, they only invent them.
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What is wrong w/ you third world people. I NEVER said ethanol in itself was "evil". I NEVER said eth. is bad for engines. I have said Eth. corrodes components that WILL cause engine damage. One fragment of gasket or fuel line enters the injectors or Carb, and it reduces the flow of fuel. The air flow stays the same. LEAN=HEAT=BUSTED UP SH*T. Do what you will with your NEW engines designed w/ ethanol fuel in mind. Your voodoo (all third world countries practice VOODOO right?) will protect your older engine anyway. This topic only applies to the rest of us that don't have talismans to protect us from the EVIL ETHANOL. (there NOW I said it. So if you quote me please use it in context.)
Brazil is actually the worlds largest producer/consumer of ethanol fuels due to NO fossil fuel reserves of their own. They have taken the necessary steps to insure it is compatible for its intended use. The US on the other hand is new to this type of fuel, and is woefully unprepared. Like it or not/ believe it or not. I DON"T CARE. I'm just passing a Sunday by helping other people avoid expensive repairs that are not needed if they are informed as to the cause. The post that started all this is about a fuel proof rubber coupler that was eaten from the inside out. The owner of said coupler was facing a total bill of approx. $587.00. I GAVE him a new coupler. Do you want the old one? Install it on your favorite goat or Emu or whatever, and ride off into the sunset pilgrim! I wonder if Al Gore took this kind'a sh*t... Oh wait Yeah he did... Man it's hot in here... Damn witches!
She's a witch! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrzMhU_4m-g#ws)
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The post is intended to show how ethanol fuel/ water separate at cold temps. Water will sink to the bottom. Where is the fuel pick up on a scoot. Where are the Carb jets located. Correct on the bottom. Another fact. Eth. attracts/absorbs water. This water is then introduced into the cylinder where it is converted to steam. This alone raises the compression of the engine beyond what it was intended to be. Gasoline repels water, and does not have this issue. Try reading some more vs writing so much. This link may help...
80's United Negro college fund commercial & Beginning of Soul Train (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfwpeHzc8ks#)
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Actually, that's a pretty poor test. How do we know the cloudy look on the test tube wasn't condensation on the outside of the glass from the colder water?
Poor experiment, and poor proof.
-Wolf
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Couldn't you tell by the high dollar lab he was reporting from? I KNOW that link is suspicious at BEST but I have seen this result first hand. Try it your self. Get a tube of 10% e fuel, add a few drops of water. To verify your result leave it alone till the water separates from the ethanol. You all know what happens to a warm liquid in a cold container right? condensation... It is the same as Cold liquid w/ warm surroundings. Sweat on your beer can. Eth is supposed to solve this in fuel but in changing climates it does not. Still the real issue is the corrosive nature of the beast. Have you EVER seen a rubber stopper in a liqueur bottle? (same alcohol). Ever drink from an aluminum flask? Try it some time.
http://www.fuel-testers.com/remove_water_gas.html (http://www.fuel-testers.com/remove_water_gas.html)
http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/jp9617027 (http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/jp9617027)
http://ddr.nal.usda.gov/bitstream/10113/29171/1/IND43839857.pdf (http://ddr.nal.usda.gov/bitstream/10113/29171/1/IND43839857.pdf)
http://www.iboats.com/basics/ethanol_fuels.html (http://www.iboats.com/basics/ethanol_fuels.html)
So far I have given 10 or more links, and spent all day on this. I wish some of you would stop worrying about weather or not I am spouting bull cr*p, and look it up for yourselves. Oh Al. I do indeed feel your pain.
Here's ! f'n more... http://www.srij.or.jp/newsite/magazines/english_abstract/view_detail.php?absId=1811&keepThis=true&TB_iframe=true&height=550&width=680 (http://www.srij.or.jp/newsite/magazines/english_abstract/view_detail.php?absId=1811&keepThis=true&TB_iframe=true&height=550&width=680)
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A Priest, and a small boy go walking in the woods. The day goes by, and it begins to get dark. The boy looks up and says "Father... I'm getting scared. "The priest says "Why my child?" The boy states "It is nearly dark, and I miss my mommy." The priest admits he also is a little frightened, and the boy now asks "Do you miss your mommy too?" The Priest responds "No. However it is getting dark,, and I have to walk out of here alone"
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For those that did not see the other thread on the effects of ethanol on rubber, the rest of the links I provided are there. As well as more amusing anecdotes.
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So far I have given 10 or more links, and spent all day on this.
"I can't come to bed. Someone is wrong on the Internet." :lol:
I promise to let you know when any rubber parts of my now six year-old People 250 (other than the tires, which don't interact much with the E10) needs replaced. Promise.
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I know Bro! Me too. Here Sorry bout the Priest joke. Maybe scad will - it. But try this... Go to ANY 10 RANDOM forums. Post a pole on each about these topics, and I firmly believe the result would be 70% or higher in favor for the same reasons I explained. In FACT I will bet my scoot on it. FIR REEL! Everyone see's it!!! Some areas are affected more than others, and you seem to argue that it is all houey or magic vapors that I am spreading. I stand by what I say. Take the bet. If you loose I know you aint gots no duogh rey me soooo. Find me ANY 2t crapper, and put it up. Since I know you are waiting for this post how's 3 minuits sound. No time to pre sample that way. As I just threw it out and had not researched it. Even if I DID that by itself should PROVE you are just sucking wind in a closet! How 'bout it BRO! 3 Min.
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Yo! Pres. I see you in the closet Bro. Come on . It will be EPIC! Put up or shut up! Come on B*TCH! I see you on line...
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YUP! Jus wut I thunk!
Say Goodnight Gracie Live! (Insomniacs lullaby) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9ovpdw7ciA#)
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you seem to argue that it is all houey or magic vapors that I am spreading.
No, I actually think that my scooter was built using special, extraterrestrial materials which seem to be impervious to the evils of E10 fuel. Or maybe it's because it's a rare day mine isn't running on the road. Or maybe both (and yes, the moon landings were faked). :lol:
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So how bout it Bro. Put up a scoot?
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So how bout it Bro. Put up a scoot?
Absolutely not. What you believe, right or wrong, impacts my scooter @ 0%, and beyond the entertainment value, what more can I ask from this thread? ;)
Declare victory, and ride, I say.
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I already did the Lone Ranger sooo. And tell your little "friends" to stay out of my face too! Go on w/ ya!
Your Bad Self (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rr3-GgzvKTE#ws)
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Do what you will with your NEW engines designed w/ ethanol fuel in mind. Your voodoo (all third world countries practice VOODOO right?) will protect your older engine anyway.
Zombies may call it voodoo. ;)
Nikolaus August Otto (inventor of the Otto engine) constructed his engine for bio-ethanol (at that time made from potatoes).
Henry Ford (someone you may know from school): “The fuel of the future is going to come from fruit like that sumach out by the road, or from apples, weeds, sawdust – almost anything.â€
Read about ethanol fuel: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Model_T (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Model_T)
Perhaps the US amnesia concerning alcohol results from the prohibition 1919. ;)
BTW: What's the actual cold weather in Florida? Munich airport (still flat country, not alps) had -22°C last night.
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A Priest, and a small boy go walking in the woods.
Must have been fun growing up where you grew up. ;D ;D
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Zombies may call it voodoo. ;)
Nikolaus August Otto (inventor of the Otto engine) constructed his engine for bio-ethanol (at that time made from potatoes).
Henry Ford (someone you may know from school): “The fuel of the future is going to come from fruit like that sumach out by the road, or from apples, weeds, sawdust – almost anything.â€
Read about ethanol fuel: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Model_T (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Model_T)
Some might be surprised to find out that there are countries around the world where Otto engines are powered by 100 % ethanol.
They must be deteriorating rapidly. :) :) :)
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“IDIOT, n. A member of a large and powerful tribe whose influence in human affairs has always been dominant and controlling. The Idiot's activity is not confined to any special field of thought or action, but "pervades and regulates the whole." He has the last word in everything; his decision is unappealable. He sets the fashions and opinion of taste, dictates the limitations of speech and circumscribes conduct with a dead-line.â€
Ambrose Bierce quotes
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Or, in this case, Mr. Butthurt Dweller.
Google it.
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For the love of god MAKE IT STOPPPPP!!!!
E fuel was most likely what they used form the beginning of Int.Comb. engines. Aluminum was not in use then. Natural rubber was. The E does NOT attack natural rubber. It does NOT attack Nitrile. It attacks the polymeric bond between rubber, and nitrile. separating the two. I posted a wager for MY scoot against (at this point) ANY other that can PROVE E has no effect on either Alum. or the rubber compounds used in fuel systems.
Oh wait this is a sure thing! ANY TAKERS. Like I told pres. I see you b*tches are on line... Tsi you are really debating a different topic. Your points are correct but a different topic. Ps It has been in the mid 40's here for the past three days. The coldest its been all year. I have to go release more Freon to warm it up a bit. Unless you are gonna tell me that won't work too~
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Actually, that's a pretty poor test. How do we know the cloudy look on the test tube wasn't condensation on the outside of the glass from the colder water?
Poor experiment, and poor proof.
-Wolf
Once more, I'm with you Wolf. There is plenty of info on the internet, enough so that I will stop using any additives. Actually, it seems that baking soda, mystery oil or colemen fuel are better additives. I'll use none of it.
Richard L.
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I wonder what Fluffie would say to that?
8th Wonder of the World? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1fHZXOXrc30#ws)
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Yep! By the way, I have some ocean front property in AZ that I want to sell you!
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Soon enough... It's an investment for my grand babies. How Much? Paypal ok? Pm me.
No offense Cali. people.