KymcoForum.com
Scooters - 125 to 300 => Agility 125 => Topic started by: SiRen8 on September 13, 2023, 08:26:48 AM
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Hi Guys,
I hope somebody can point me in the right direction for a problem with starting. I'm not sure if the issue started with there being no power after turning the key some months ago but thought i ought to mention it, i seemed to have corrected that by pumping some wd40 into it a few times. Recently i noticed that the engine sounded sluggish whilst trying to start, i checked the Battery and it seemed to be ok on the Multi metre. I decided i would change it anyway but the problem was still there. I've now also changed the Starter and Starter Relay and it has got worse. The starter now just makes a whirring noise like it isnt engaging. I dont know what else to do???
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@SiRen8 welcome here!7
A starting issue is always to be found.
You changed already.starter motor, starter relais and battery, right?
So we hook them off.
WHERE into pumped WD 40?
Please see diagram.
There are several parts which could cause this behavior.
- first dont trust your multimeter and take a bigger battery and try to jumpstart
- no success
- check this big ground cable from battery to starter
- check cables on your starter relais, tight seat
-check sparkplug, cable and cap
- ?
Did you buy the CORRECT starter or any?
There are some which have a different sprocket!
-startermotor exact mounted with O-ring?
- your scoot has a freewheel clutch within your RH motorside, that one can stick and therefore startermotor is not engaging
Cure: startermotor out and spray this clutch with light oil
- also your kill switch or ignition switch could be a culprit
Pls check all this out, give us a feedback to learn.
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Hi Ruffus,
Many thanks for the quick response. Can i just confirm that to oil the Freewheel Clutch, i remove the new starter and spray light oil in the hole? Also some added info, the starter was engaging for a while but really struggling to turn the engine over then stopped altogether and now just spins...
Simon
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Hi Ruffus,
Many thanks for the quick response. Can i just confirm that to oil the Freewheel Clutch, i remove the new starter and spray light oil in the hole? Also some added info, the starter was engaging for a while but really struggling to turn the engine over then stopped altogether and now just spins...
Simon
Yes right.
BUT before you remove anything try to jumpstart from a car (motor maximal idle).
Check all cables. Go step by step through all of it.
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Thank you, i will try all this and post my findings ;)
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So I ran jump leads to the starter motor direct and it spins but does not engage
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Pls start from beginning:
-check starter relais cables tight and functioning
-check cables leading to ground and plus to startermotor for corrosion
-put jumpcables on your scooter battery
-kill switch
-side stand
-all fuses
If all this is in working order..... starter still refuses to crank.
Where did you spray WD 40 in it?
No other way than to take the startermotor out and have a look.
Once again. Is this the correct starter motor?
Faulty freewheel clutches are known but very rarely.
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Hi Ruffus,
* Starter Relay - functioning as i can here it engaging
* Will correctly check the Earth cables
* Did try jump cables onto my battery but not since new starter and battery fitted
* My bike doesny have a kill switch, unless you mean the key ignition?
* Side stand??
* I can see 2 fuses in with the Battery that look ok
* I sprayed WD40 into the Ignition key hole
* The starter motor was bought from Racing Planet and fits perfectly with rubber seal etc
The one thing i keep thinking of is that the original problem started with no power when i turned the key, once i jiggled the key a few time it came to life. It also cut out whilst riding on one occasion....
Many thanks for suggestions
Simon
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Ok, got it.
-side stand I meant, is there a switch which could fail
- try ignition lock again to be sure
- bridge starter relais (two big brass bolts) to start
- change fuses
- check seat of all cables, tight or corrosion
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I'm not sure if the side stand has a switch but will look. I bridged the starter relay a few days ago and just whirring of the starter motor without it engaging. I'm now able to get the bike into a dry garage so can look at things a bit better. how would you test the ignition lock?
Many thanks
Simon
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Ignition lock:
- take the best (mechanically) original key you have
- spray the key with WD40 or similar, put it in
- turn on all sides (unlock seat, fuelcap)
- hear something whirring (fuelpump, relais ticking[ blinker on] etc)...
- ignition position, lights on/ off?
- ignition pos. , start? brakelights on?
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This may or may not be relevant, but there's two completely different start motor types in Kymco scooters. Some have a simple bendix-type spring engagement, while others are the free-wheeling centrifugal type. Here we are assuming that it's a centrifugal-type, but we're just guessing since we don't know what model of Kymco we're dealing with.
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Sorry NO, Agility has the tube type starter motor shown at diagram further up and freewheel clutch indide RH motor casing.
I still doubt this clutch to be faulty, didn't see any until now broken, except somebody assambled wrongly.
For bendix- type starter motor pls see pic. The early 50cc scoots had such items. Inexpensive, easy to replace. Additionally this type would sit in the scoots CVT casing. Front pulley to be removed.
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OK so have the bike stripped to the frame, I've looked at ignition and all working. Traced wiring to voltage regulator and one of the connections was pretty bad with rusty terminals, I've wd40 and cleaned. Found main earth on frame and removed connections, cleaned and reconnected. Spark plug cable looks OK to me. Reconnected battery and starter still just spinning with no engagement 🙄
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Hmmmh, I think there is no other way as:
- take starter motor out
- look whether you are able to reach this sprocket (pls see pic)
and turn (bent screwdriver, hook, firepoker, whatever...)
- compare old starter motor with new one (lenght, teeth, etc)
-pls watch att pic from motorside
- your startermotor by mounting would come automatically into this sprocket
-as a long shot: is your startermotor ALL the way in there (green arrow)
- this must be found...coz a starter is such a humble device...
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Thanks Ruffus, this is really useful info ;)
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Hi Ruffus,
I've now split the engine so I can see the starter clutch etc. Could you explain to me how this item works as the large cog which spins the engine is loose and move able? I thought the starter clutch was all one piece?
Many thanks
S
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Here we go:
- starter clutch IS one piece, but has to be driven by something too (pls see pic when dismantled)
- the other pic shows you (arrow) where the starter sprocked grips in
- further down chain and drive for oilpump
BTW: watch out, this big special 4- pronged nut has LH tread
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Here we go:
- starter clutch IS one piece, but has to be driven by something too (pls see pic when dismantled)
- the other pic shows you (arrow) where the starter sprocked grips in
- further down chain and drive for oilpump
BTW: watch out, this big special 4- pronged nut has LH tread
icant see any pics?
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Ok i can now see the pics and all looks the same other than i havent yet removed the castle nut to release the starter clutch. I think the Starter Clutch is broken but wont know until i remove it. Is there a pin or something that locks that castle nut?
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No, no pin nothing, only this nut has LH tread!!
Means to unlock, turn it CLOCKWISE.
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Ok ive ordered a special tool to remove the Castle Nut. its a pity i cant post pics as it says they're to big...
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In case you don't get this tool, it can easily made from a fitting socket using a small flex to cut it out.
For pics: take pics with your smartphone
- minimize them with an downloaded app
- put them in your script
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In case you don't get this tool, it can easily made from a fitting socket using a small flex to cut it out.
For pics: take pics with your smartphone
- minimize them with an downloaded app
- put them in your script
Castle Nut Tool wasn't long enough
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This "castle-nut" is easily to be opened(clockwise) with a chisel and hammer, once unlocked thenwith pliers. Don't worry about a few schratches on this nut.
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Removed the castle nut and then the drive cog, the starter clutch was attached by 3 Allan key screws. One of them was really loose and has been rubbing the back of the cog....
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Removed the castle nut and then the drive cog, the starter clutch was attached by 3 Allan key screws. One of them was really loose and has been rubbing the back of the cog....
...degrease, check sprockets for mechanical faults and back in again. LOCTITE for hydaulic is used on this allen key nuts.
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Should I get a new starter clutch etc just incase?
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Yes, would be good, BUT will highly depend on
a) availabilty ???
b) price at US ?
Here in Italy I would not hesitate a second.
(pls see pic)
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Yes, would be good, BUT will highly depend on
a) availabilty ???
b) price at US ?
These parts are also shared with smaller Kawasaki ATVs. I use Kawasaki parts routinely. The Kawasaki parts people are clueless about the interchange codes so you have to do some of your own legwork. But the parts come in a Kymco package with a Kawasaki label attached. Note the attached photo is just an example, not the part you're seeking.
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OK so the stator and pick up tested fine so it's not that. Does anybody actually know the correct size castle nut tool as I don't really want go hammer it on?
Cheers
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I wasn't aware there were different sizes for GY6 starter clutch nut tools? Don't they all look like a big, 3 inch long impact socket?
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Three possibilities for this nut:
- make one 19/20/21 mm socket fitting (anglegrinder)
- hammer/chisel method
- try to find this special tool at HAZET , Harborfreight, etc