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General => General Discussion => Topic started by: Iahawk on December 24, 2021, 06:13:15 PM
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I posted this on the Helix site but it's pretty quiet these days..and it's really more of a general scooter / motorcycle question, anyway.
My Honda Helix has incandescent turn signal bulbs. The fronts also act as running lights, staying on at reduced power all the time, which I really like.
I want to convert to led due to the dim nature of the factory style incandescents. I bought the correct led bulbs (all the pins match up correctly) and an led flasher relay.
Relay arrived today and the plug and pins match up correctly to the factory plug. (I also double checked with multimeter which wire had power). after installing the new relay and putting the led bulbs I get some strange issues
problem 1. The front running lights don't light up when I turn the key on, now, like they should. If I activate the turn signal and then cancel that side will stay on. Then I activate the other side and cancel and it sometimes stays on but mostly doesn't.
Problem 2. with front led bulbs and rear incandescents the flash rate is correct. With all 4 leds they hyperflash. My flasher relay is a Rizoma universal led relay..should prevent hyperflashing, right?
Sockets are clean, pins line up but front running lights don't turn on at start...and right one doesn't stay on well. I could live with front leds and rear incandescents but the right bulb not staying on as a running light kills that. Right bulb turns on with signal and then stays on as running light after cancelling..some of the time...but not all the time.
I can always go back to the (dim) incandescents..which would kind of suck after buying a $20 relay and spending $40 on bulbs.
With a new led flasher relay on my NInja and S200 the led bulb conversion was simple and worked perfectly. I'm at a loss for what could be causing these issues.
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@hawk, first of all, Merry Christmas!
I'm not the electric guru, but this issue with your LEDs is wellknown throughout motorcycle forums.
Seems (LED) to have simply too less resistance or power consumption to work properly as they should.
Read somewhere, guys put a resistor in this indicator line...
But for sure there is someone who did such a conversion.
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thank, Ruffus, Merry Christmas to you, too! (and to all of our Kymco Forum!)
I may just be out of luck with getting led's on my Helix...too bad as the standard bulbs are so dim. Maybe replacing them with new ones will help a bit. At least my new flasher relay works just fine when I put the old bulbs back in.
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With 175,000 miles of Helix experience, standard bulbs worked fine for me.
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With 175,000 miles of Helix experience, standard bulbs worked fine for me.
they do, John, they're just pretty dim by modern standards. I would like to be as visible as possible on 2 wheels. The led's are about twice as bright as the incandescents.
Modern vehicles, as annoying as some of those bright led headlights are, sure are more visible to others than dimmer, yellow sealed beams lights of old used to be. Same for the newer, brighter led turn signals and running lights.
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@hawk, maybe take smthg like that, it's plug 'n play, just into those indicator cables... (pls see pic)
Inexpensive and could be rebuilt, if neccessary.
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I think much safer to wear bright colored clothes/reflective, and work on riding technique, and stay out of people's way.
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@john, I think seeing, riding twowheelers, from point of safety, it would be tbe best bet to leave our rides within the garage and just adore them.
Changing something I see also as a technical progress, without this curiosity we would be still in mechanical iceage.
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with the led's not working properly I wonder if the simple addition of resistors to each light would solve the multiple problems?
I've not heard of someone needing to use both an led flasher relay AND resistors..but maybe that would solve this? at $4.95 USD each it would be cheap enough to give it a try.
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@hawk, I know $$ 20,- is some money too, but I would try out of "want to know".
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@hawk, I know $$ 20,- is some money too, but I would try out of "want to know".
Ruffus, I think I will give it a try. I really can't see anything else causing problems with the bulbs..maybe a good old fashioned resistor will fix the problem! (and the leds look SO good on the scoot..the brightness level and crisp flashing would be nice)
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Read somewhere, guys put a resistor in this indicator line...
But for sure there is someone who did such a conversion.
Yes, it's been covered in great detail here on the Kymco Forum. Wiring diagrams, resistors, flashers, every detail. It's here somewhere with the last 2 years. Don't remember exactly where!
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@hawk, there are some bits and pieces..
https://www.kymcoforum.com/index.php?topic=30779.msg215723#msg215723
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Ruffus, I think I will give it a try. I really can't see anything else causing problems with the bulbs..maybe a good old fashioned resistor will fix the problem! (and the leds look SO good on the scoot..the brightness level and crisp flashing would be nice)
Do let us know the outcome Hawk, I’m keeping my🤞
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I ordered 4 resistors last night. Delivery in about a week so I’ll definitely give them a try. I also have a spare led flasher relay from when I bought 2 (due to massive shipping delays at that time) during the height of the pandemic in the Spring of ‘20.
Just to rule out a defective led flasher relay I plan on hooking up my spare to see if anything changes. If not, I’ll install the resistors next week and report back.
In the meantime…our first snow of the season..rain, sleet, ice and snow…ugly day out there!
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well....it's tough to admit defeat, but sometimes you have to...and these led's on the Helix beat me. I just came back in from the garage after removing the 3M Scotchlock connectors off the 4 wires from the 2 resistors (those are a pain to remove..and I probably shouldn't have used that type of connector in the first place), making a cut where the scotchlock nicked the wires and using crimp on, butt splice/heat shrink connectors along with a dab of oxidation inhibitor on each bare wire end to re-hook up the front turn signal wires.
I tried using an led flasher relay with front led bulbs and it didn't work correctly. I tried a spare relay I had..and it didn't work. I purchased and installed resistors and they didn't work. I tried the resistors with both led relays as well as the factory relay. Nope..nothing...
The running lights never came on or stayed on correctly and I still had hyperflash from the left signal.
I think in this case John Grinsel was right...leave well enough alone and stay with the factory lights. (I'll just have to enjoy the super bright led signals on my Ninja and S200)
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@hawk, yes sometimes you have to give in. But there must be a possibility to make this work, otherwise no other scoot or motorcycle would run with LED lights and flashers. Maybe time will show something.
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I agree, Ruffus, it should work, or there should be a way to get it to work. Something on my scoot (or something I did, incorrectly) prevents this from working.
On my motorcycle and Kymco scooter all I had to do was swap in a led relay and everything worked perfectly. Not on this old Honda...the difference is my other two don't have front running lights like the Honda does.
I may look at some led bulbs that come with built in resistors in the future.
In my neverending quest to be more visible my next move may be to put in a superbright led headlight bulb in the Helix..I've seen it done on Helix and Elite 250s. I'm not concerned with the nighttime light spread as I don't ride at night. I'm more concerned with visibility to others.
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Hawk, I've had some motorcycles with an LED coming at me in my truck.....with such a glare that they were hard to discern....and this was in the daytime.
Yes, something is coming....?!
Stig