KymcoForum.com
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: CROSSBOLT on June 29, 2019, 02:00:34 AM
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The Downtown 300i is just about to hit the TWI bars on the rear tire at a little over 6000 miles and I am steamed! The dual compound Michelin Power Pure SC was a little better than the rest but not good enough! I'm gonna do it. I'm going to the "DARKSIDE!" That means CAR TIRE! There. I said it. Yes, a car tire. Steel belt radial, 13 inch car tire. A 160/70R13 Cooper (first on the list since we have a set on the minivan) will be on there before my trip to Huntsville, AL in August. It is not that it will last for about ever or that it is cheaper than the scooter tires that think they are motorcycle tires. It is because I get tired of changing tires. Sorta like cuttin' grass and fixin' lawn mowers every summer. One of the things I enjoy just NOT ALL THE TIME!! Go to darkside.nwff.info is the website if you are interested. Lots of "adventure riders" (advrider.com) use them on their really long trips up the highways to Alaska an' stuff like that. Will post the results as I go along.....from the DARKSIDE!
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Well....there he goes ….. 😊
Old crossthread knows he's going to get a lot of grief doing this....but a lot of guys swear by it. (quite a few Burgman owners go to a rear car tire)
There's a rear tire camera youtube video of one going down the street.
Stig
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Besides car tire not designed for solo bike/car and MC rims different on bead area (there is SAE paper on this)….and then planning on going around corners?
I have noticed my 2019 XTown 300i seems to be rear tire sensitive at 7500 miles so far.....think it likes "round" tires....and tires that wear round. Michelin City Grip on it right now/think front Kenda front(China) wearing a little square.
Once I bought a Harley WLA 45 with junkyard 18" car tires....almost impossible to ride----Germany, MZ sidecar outfit----with 15 inch 2CV car tire and special tube/special rim----could be legal with sidecar, against the law solo.
With now over 400,000 miles on rubber band drive scooters...I find my Kymco the most rear tire sensitive/fussy....and it is my 11th new maxiscooter. Poor design makes rear wheel removal a pain on all that I have had---think only BMW scooter has single sided swing arm.---and to think in the 50's European scooters used to come with spare tires/props to hold wheel up/and wheels easy to remove.
Mounting car tire on scooter rim, make sure you do it yourself----I have heard real bear...that should be clue something isn't right. Last, I once in WI gas station guy on FJR1300 with car tire on rear unable to make turn in space available to get to pumps....he had to back up and try again.
My second new Suzuki Burgman 400---did get 11,000 miles out of Power Pure SC on return from trip to AK.
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Is it common to replace just the rear tire and wait for the front to wear out, or both at the same time?
(not trying to hijack thread, seems like appropriate follow up question)
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Don't know about front, monkey. So far, what I have seen is only on the back. I also have to say, John, is if this PP SC had lasted 11000 miles, then we would not be discussing this right now. Ever since I started riding two wheels in 1960, the back tire goes faster than the front. But an old Maxxis at 3500? Avon Viper Stryke at 4000? Never got to see how the Metzler did BECAUSE SOME DOPE FIEND STOLE THE DT AND WRECKED IT!! So since 2013, I have spooned tires FIVE TIMES! Gettin' tired (har, har!) of it. I think also, John, that someone at the Michelin factory cheated on that hard compound...
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www.darkside.nwff.info (http://www.darkside.nwff.info) and www.advrider.com (http://www.advrider.com)
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Anyone have a suggestion for "old CROSSTHREAD" for a replacement for the rear tire "huggy" fender? Don't think that car tire gonna fit under it....
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C-Threads,
Drive down to the Piggly Wiggly, buy two 8-packs of Busch beer.
Sit on your riding mower (probably best to give the keys to the Mrs.) drink 'em all, get sick - then pound them flat and connect them - forming your custom fender hugger. Used to see houses made out of flattened pop and beer cans in SVN.
Stig
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Yep, they WOULD make good shingles!
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I see question on replacing front and rear tires at same time----ideal world they should be replaced together at same time in matched pairs------real world, usually 2 rear=one front. Think it is important at least to do the size bike maker recommends, there are a million opinions on which tire brand works best.
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I see question on replacing front and rear tires at same time----ideal world they should be replaced together at same time in matched pairs------real world, usually 2 rear=one front. Think it is important at least to do the size bike maker recommends, there are a million opinions on which tire brand works best.
Yup, yup and yup. First driven by economics. Second makes sense for speedo function and engine rpm/speed relation and third driven by preference. Second point, the rolling diameter of the Michelin PP SC is 21.81 inches and the car tire that is 150/70R13 is like 21.28" D. A 160/70R13 is 21.82"D.
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On Power Pure SC lasting 11,000 miles----on return from long trip, tire had to last to get home---Although Burgman 400 rear is same as Honda SilverWing/Kymco XTown 300i-----just try stopping in bike shop when underway on trip---they just do not keep them in stock!! So I made the choice to ride on home---made it,tire carcas safe--tread not so in rain.....just had to compensate for that.
Also sitting at home riding very little people tend to worry about tire----out on trip with 1-2,000 mile a week tire situation/appearance changes quickly- and probably not worth constant worry----fresh tires I do not worry about, old/stale tires cause me some worry and extra checking.
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I'd be happy to get 6,000 miles on a rear tire. The OEM tire on my Like 150i lasted all of 1,700 miles. I have tried several different brands of tires on my Majesty and have yet to get 6,000 miles out of any of them.
The OEM tires on my Super 8 did last around 9,000 miles but they were really hard tires.
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When I was doing courier work, I was cooking a rear tyre every 5000 miles on a 110cc - so much of it is down to riding style. I was also cooking brake pads at that rate... stop... start... stop... start...
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I get that riding style is proportional to tire life or around the other way. Found out today that 13" car tires virtually non-existant! Must dig some more!
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I get that riding style is proportional to tire life or around the other way. Found out today that 13" car tires virtually non-existant! Must dig some more!
Check over on the Burgman 400 forum. Pretty sure the rear Burg tire is a 13".....and a lot of guys are running car/trailer tires there.
Stig
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Yeah, on that Darkside link they practically feature the Burg 400! They list an Achilles 155/80R13 and I just ordered one from Amazon for 35 bucks. I will go to that forum just to find out what all they ARE using! Thanks! I need options other than short lived scoot tires.....
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New car tire in yesterday! Pictures soon. Change starts tomorrow (maybe).
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Good luck getting tire on/bead seated---my take on car tires on solo bikes....if this were the way to go, road racers would be using them, and bikes/scooters would come from factory with car tires.
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Well, John, all I gotta say on the matter is fooey! Sticking with "we always done it that way" does not cut it. I got a couple of sea stories on that very phenomenon I just might post. I intend to post on this topic good or bad.
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Got the tire, got some pictures....NOW the file is too big! OK, one picture of the $35 USD tire the Burgman 400 guys get 20000 miles before needing replacement.
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This will give an idea the replacement is one inch in diameter larger than the PP before it worn. I am a little concerned about getting the little fender over this new tire.
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If it's just the width needs to be larger, maybe gentle work with a heat gun?
+1" diameter will likely be felt in the acceleration & response to throttle -- maybe?
Your report will be interesting!
Lotta 300 owners out there.
Stig
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The 150/70R13 is smaller by about .6" and did not want that.
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Yeah, that would have been pretty zippy off the line, but raised your revs through all indicated speeds.
When I couldn't get the OEM tire after the flat on my Forza, they mounted the next best option. Slightly taller tire, but my riding style doesn't require aggressive take offs. Did put the speedo spot-on, though!
Stig
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By the way, the People GTi300 with its 16" wheels the tire OD is 22.83". Big wheel, skinny tire.
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my tires on the piaggio b v 350 is 110/70 16 ,. when I install the next tire I am looking at a 120 / 80 16 front tire,. rear tire is 150/ 70 14, looking for a 160/ 70 14 , hard to find, I think it is a motor-cycle size, my rim is 4 " wide rear tire , what size tire would fit it?
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Same problem as with the DT300i. You just have to decide what is more important, overall diameter or wear life. The car tire 165/60R14 is what the Burgman guys use in the 650 and it fits in the machine but mounting the car tire is a pain. Some sizes like what you want either don't exist or have become extinct.
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Second time on this----how hard was car tire getting on rim? And what psi needed to seat bead? I have heard up to 90 psi....there is some danger to this, unless tire in cage.
#2 if tire and wheel do not fit in "over fender" just do not use it. On my 11th maxi scooter.....only Kymco has such a nice feature----the others just let the mud fly.
Up and running tell us what car tire has done to handling.
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Second time on this----how hard was car tire getting on rim? And what psi needed to seat bead? I have heard up to 90 psi....there is some danger to this, unless tire in cage.
#2 if tire and wheel do not fit in "over fender" just do not use it. On my 11th maxi scooter.....only Kymco has such a nice feature----the others just let the mud fly.
Up and running tell us what car tire has done to handling.
Can't. Can't find my tire levers! Everything stopped until.....
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Got tire mounted! Seated beads at 60 psi, easy-peasy. Now have to relocate air filter box to clear side of auto tire. Plan to space it laterally about one quarter inch.
No tire abrasion with BB's. Some evidence of impact inside of rim.
Second picture is TWI just being touched!
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Good job Karl!
Looking forward to your ride report.
Stig
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Assemble, disassemble....repeat. Found that air filter housing will need two bolts, M6-1.0x40 mm and two 10 mm long spaces for clearance to back tire. The tire huggy thingy will not fit so if this set up works half-way decently there will be a flap added to keep road grit off engine. No pictures on this. Too tired by puttin' together and takin' apart....
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Got the bolts, made the spacers, put it together and RODE IT! RPM's a tiny bit lower at 60-70, no noticable handling differences, ride over rough stuff VASTLY IMPROVED! Much less harsh with the auto tire. Started in the recommended "sweet spot" tire pressure range of 33 psi. Half hour ride at mid 80's ambient, pressure increase to 38, a gain of 5 psi. Tread was quite warm, sidewalls not so warm. Big difference: the whole scooter tire would be HOT! Cornering was the biggest surprise as it felt no different. I will try some pictures later...nap time!
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Well alright then! (Latin: Cool Beans!)
If you was gonna die with this set-up it woulda happened before your nap.
Well done you!
Stig
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Thank you! 150 mile trip coming up and maybe pictures...
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Thank you! 150 mile trip coming up and maybe pictures...
Most likely there are other 300 owners who will be interested in photos of your modifications needed to make that tire fit.
Stig
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Good luck with car tire---hope you don't kill yourself---might be fun in rainy curves. Make sure your insurance is still valid with rear car tire.
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Good luck with car tire---hope you don't kill yourself---might be fun in rainy curves. Make sure your insurance is still valid with rear car tire.
Thanks, John! I needed that. Actually, there are so many who have been doing this car tire on two wheel fun machines WITH NO PROBLEMS to be wrong. I will be killed by some other means, I reckon...
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Near center there is the head of a socket head cap screw with a washer, the air box tab, the 8 mm spacer and to the right is the metal tab of the CVT. This is duplicated forward. This scheme allows some clearance between the back of the airbox and the tire. No marks on the tire...yet!
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Remember in the EU and UK car tires on solo machine with bike rims are illegal----ok with sidecar, provided there is special car rim. Remember how the bike goes down the road under calm conditions one thing......but what about emergency situations----sign me BSc safety here.
I find my 2019 XTown 300i very sensitive to rear tire and handling and feel---Michelin City Crip in proper size there now=works ok, but not perfect.
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EU and UK have forgotten Captain Blighe, "We are not talking justice, we are talking LAW!" Prior to hanging Billy Budd. The UK in particular gave us Lucas electrics, two fuse cars and completely unreliable ignition systems while the Japanese were showing the way to really modern electrics that were reliable. They did give us Dunlop and hydoplaning empirical speeds. Not really interested in what either EU or UK lawmakers say about anything considering some of the really stupid laws they have foisted on their people. So how many miles have you with a car tire on a motorcycle/scooter? What are your EMPERICAL results? Or is it just comtempt before investigation?
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Mid 50's I bought very used Harley WLA 45 with junk yard 18 inch car tires-----not much fun to ride until proper 18" MC tires were mounted
80's in Germany, MZ sidecar outfit---15 inch 2 CV tire, special tube with outset stem, spoked a little outset for clearance, legal for sidecar car use----expensive way to avoid changing cheap MC drive tires. Bike worked ok and looked fine----this mod had to be recorded in title to be legal. Once tried bike solo, just down the street=no thanks for me, just too goofy handling.
My take: after 11 new maxiscooters since 1990 and over 400,000 miles with them----best to stick with OEM recommended rear tire size MC tire, proper speed rating and load rating.
Reason for strict tire wheel/tire regs in EU----the high speed there----most Americans would probably fill their pants using these speeds----Harley riders don't have to worry....their engines blow up run wide open. I lived/worked/rode for 25 years in Europe.
Having had 2 new SilverWings/2 new Burgman 400's, where car tire conversions where common.......but really never saw one being used for serious long distance riding.
One last thing, once in WI, saw Yamaha FJR1300 with car tire rear unable to make turn to gas pump, without backing up. Couldn't lean.
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Well, with all that experience, mostly negative, I am going to remove that lethal thing and go back to changing tires every 4 to 6 thousand miles! I WILL report my exeperiences with this project whether good or bad. By the way, you have a counterpart on the Suzuki Burgman forum, one guy who has an educated reason against nearly everything.
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has any one tried a winter tire for the soft rubber for better grip , I could not find one to fit my scooter a 150/ 70 14 with a 4 " rim width, most car tires require 6 " rims or more,. how do you get around that ? the right size rim would cost a fortune if it waS AVAILABLE,. I bumped the cap key,. fat fingers! cant be old?????
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I just state facts from experience----and common knowledge from other parts of the world. Having had 2 new Burgman 400's and 2 new SilverWings---ridden them to AK, SilverWing as far east as NB in Canada.....I never saw any of the internet jockeys out riding on their scooters....to acquire long miles to make car tire last.
One must remember I have been riding everyday for 64 years, using bike scooter for everything---didn't get married until 65, so had plenty of money to waste on bikes, enjoyed it. Over 75 new bikes/scooters. My experience----modern maxi scooter with fresh set of proper tires, should be good for about 10,000 miles with no worries other than a flat now and then.
I hate to think about how much money I have wastes on bikes....but who cares?
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has any one tried a winter tire for the soft rubber for better grip , I could not find one to fit my scooter a 150/ 70 14 with a 4 " rim width, most car tires require 6 " rims or more,. how do you get around that ? the right size rim would cost a fortune if it waS AVAILABLE,. I bumped the cap key,. fat fingers! cant be old?????
The 155/80R13 seems like a skinny tire and the Downtown has a 13" rim like the Burgman 400.
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Why would anyone want to put a radial tire on scooter designed for bias??
In Germany---winter tires are required for bikes/scooters. Simple=find winter tire bias/scooter in proper size for the bike......and of course matched front, too! I think "winter tires" are safe for limited summer use or until they are worn out.
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Can we trust experts?
From today’s Ark.-Dem. Gazette -
By Walter Williams
Senior Fellow at the Hoover Institution, Stanford University
Former Treasury Secretary Larry Summers predicted that if Donald Trump were elected, there would be a protracted recession within 18 months. Heeding its experts, a month before the election the Washington Post ran an editorial with the headline "A President Trump could destroy the world economy."
Steve Rattner, a Democratic financier and former head of the National Economic Council, warned, "If the unlikely event happens and Trump wins, you will see a market crash of historic proportions." When Trump's electoral victory became apparent, Nobel Prize-winning economist and New York Times columnist Paul Krugman warned that the world was "very probably looking at a global recession, with no end in sight."
By the way, Krugman has been so wrong in so many of his economic predictions, but that doesn't stop him from making more shameless predictions.
People whom we've trusted as experts have often been wrong beyond imagination. Irving Fisher, a distinguished Yale University economics professor in 1929, predicted, "Stock prices have reached what looks like a permanently high plateau." Three days later, the stock market crashed.
In 1945, regarding money spent on the Manhattan Project, Adm. William Leahy told President Harry S. Truman, "That is the biggest fool thing we have ever done. The bomb will never go off, and I speak as an expert in explosives."
In 1903, the president of the Michigan Savings Bank, advising Henry Ford's lawyer not to invest in Ford Motor Co., said, "The horse is here to stay, but the automobile is only a novelty--a fad." Confidence in the staying power of the horse was displayed by a 1916 comment of the aide-de-camp to Field Marshal Douglas Haig at a tank demonstration: "The idea that cavalry will be replaced by these iron coaches is absurd. It is little short of treasonous."
Albert Einstein predicted: "There is not the slightest indication that nuclear energy will ever be obtainable. It would mean that the atom would have to be shattered at will." In 1899, Charles H. Duell, the U.S. commissioner of patents, said, "Everything that can be invented has been invented." Listening to its experts in 1936, the New York Times predicted, "A rocket will never be able to leave the Earth's atmosphere."
To prove that it's not just academics, professionals and business people who make harebrained predictions, Hall of Fame baseball player Tris Speaker's 1919 advice about Babe Ruth was, "Taking the best left-handed pitcher in baseball and converting him into a right fielder is one of the dumbest things I ever heard." For those of us not familiar with baseball, Babe Ruth was one of the greatest outfielders who ever played the game.
The world's geniuses are by no means exempt from out-and-out nonsense. Sir Isaac Newton (1642-1727) was probably the greatest scientist of all time. He laid the foundation for classical mechanics; he transformed our understanding of physics, mathematics and astronomy. What's not widely known is that Newton spent most of his waking hours on alchemy. Some of his crackpot experiments included trying to turn lead into gold. He wrote volumes on alchemy, but after his death, Britain's Royal Society deemed that they were "not fit to be printed."
Then there's mathematical physicist and engineer Lord Kelvin (1824-1907), whose major contribution was in thermodynamics. Kelvin is widely recognized for determining the correct value of absolute zero, approximately minus 273.15 degrees Celsius or minus 459.67 degrees Fahrenheit. In honor of his achievement, extremely high and extremely low temperatures are expressed in units called kelvins.
To prove that one can be a genius in one area and an idiot in another, Kelvin challenged geologists by saying that the Earth is between 20 million and 100 million years old. Kelvin predicted, "X-rays will prove to be a hoax." And he told us, "I can state flatly that heavier-than-air flying machines are impossible."
The point of all this is to say that we can listen to experts, but take what they predict with a grain or two of salt.
------------v------------
Walter E. Williams is a professor of economics at George Mason University.
Editorial on 07/26/2018
î¢
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You can trust me.....my experience is long and in some cases expensive! Waiting for long trip test of car rear tire and how she handles....in rain,too.
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Me, too!
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Here should be a picture of the DT with rear car tire 155/80R13 on the bike. Lighting not good, just outline
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OK, throw a Moon Pie on a blanket, get down there with a camera, or cell phone with flash, and give us a photo of where the beef meets the road on the side stand.
Your present picture, nice, reminds me somehow of the beefy hind quarters of a certain sister-in-law. Chunky back there. Your tire, I mean.
Stig
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Me, too! Har, har! Who gonna throw the Moon pie? I hear those go well with an RC cola....
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Karl,
I think you are making a very serious mistake. When we lean into a turn the small strip of rubber on the road that keeps us attached to the road is what? an inch wide? I have a broken collar bone from using a cheap motorcycle tire that didn't hold its grip in a turn, and that was a motorcycle tire.
You intend to use a car tire, a tire that is not designed to ride on its edge. There's a reason motorcycle tires wear fast: the rubber is soft so it will grip better. I have been to mc races where the tires are trash after 100 miles: the sides are completely worn down, which is why they can ride them so far leaned over at high speed: the rubber is soft and "sticky". Touring tires will last longer than sport tires but still not nearly as long as a car tire but that's the price we pay for riding, a small price in my opinion.
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Studying all the info on this before venturing my physical well-being revealed in part the "chicken strips" at the edges of the motorcycle-type scooter tires. This unused part of the eliptical tread cross-section shows that I don't lean that much even when I really bore through a turn! There is, for some reason, a slight curve to the tread of this car tire including a radius at the edge. I cruise upright most of the time like most other highway cruisers. That mission profile is what turns the soft compound tires into junk in less than 6000 miles. I will continue to report on this so if I bust my butt, you will know about it. Notvreally too worried since hundreds of Burgman riders have been doing this for over a decade. So far, no crashes, damage or death have resulted from car tires.
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I have a number of friends who have run car tires on their motorcycles. One put one on his V strom 1000 to see for himself whether or not it was dangerous like all the "experts" predicted. He ran it as hard as he could. He cornered hard to see if it would make hime crash. He mounted a camera just behind the rear wheel to see what happened in curves. The camera showed that the tire flexed and had plenty of rubber on the road.
Eventually he put a motorcycle tire back on because it just felt better.
I have ridden with a number of riders with CTs on their bikes. All of them were able to ride their bikes at the limits in the curves. I had a guy on a Goldwing following me on some curvy roads. I could hear sonds of scraping metal behind me as he had that wing leaned way over. The tire never slipped. This guy admitted that a MC tire would be easier to ride on curvy roads. He mounted a CT for two reasons. First was that he lived on a dirt road and the CT handled much better on the dirt. Second was that he had a run flat tire which is not available in MC tires.
A lot of serious long distance riders run CTs because MC tires just don't last long enough for some of them to complete their trips without a tire change.
I have seen numerous discussions on forums about CTs. There are hundreds of riders who have run CTs without issues and on the other side of the argument are "experts" with theories about why CTs are dangerous or won't work.
I have not personally put a CT on any of my bikes but I'm tempted to put one on my Majesty. I have yet to find a scooter tire that lasts even 6,000 miles on the rear of that scooter.
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I have a number of friends who have run car tires on their motorcycles. One put one on his V strom 1000 to see for himself whether or not it was dangerous like all the "experts" predicted. He ran it as hard as he could. He cornered hard to see if it would make hime crash. He mounted a camera just behind the rear wheel to see what happened in curves. The camera showed that the tire flexed and had plenty of rubber on the road.
Eventually he put a motorcycle tire back on because it just felt better.
I have ridden with a number of riders with CTs on their bikes. All of them were able to ride their bikes at the limits in the curves. I had a guy on a Goldwing following me on some curvy roads. I could hear sonds of scraping metal behind me as he had that wing leaned way over. The tire never slipped. This guy admitted that a MC tire would be easier to ride on curvy roads. He mounted a CT for two reasons. First was that he lived on a dirt road and the CT handled much better on the dirt. Second was that he had a run flat tire which is not available in MC tires.
A lot of serious long distance riders run CTs because MC tires just don't last long enough for some of them to complete their trips without a tire change.
I have seen numerous discussions on forums about CTs. There are hundreds of riders who have run CTs without issues and on the other side of the argument are "experts" with theories about why CTs are dangerous or won't work.
I have not personally put a CT on any of my bikes but I'm tempted to put one on my Majesty. I have yet to find a scooter tire that lasts even 6,000 miles on the rear of that scooter.
This is from a guy who told me and showed me pictures of riding tight corners heeled over like Isle of Mann! Klav loves to ride hot! The guy on the Goldwing scraping metal has to be testimony.
Maybe, eventually, this will begin to influence tire manufacturers that the customer wants a rear tire that does not wear so quickly! We are "tired" of the "we always done it that way" philosphy of motorcycle/scooter tires!
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Gotta love this forum!
Please keep us posted on your experience with a car tire, Karl. Especially let us know if you crash and die. Think of how many lives you could save....
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Gotta love this forum!
Please keep us posted on your experience with a car tire, Karl. Especially let us know if you crash and die. Think of how many lives you could save....
Har, har! Have made special provisions for a blind post if I splat! I do appreciate your genuine (well, it seemed genuine!) concern in your previous comment. My recommendation is to read the same stuff about "darksiding" that I have. Considering, for discussion, that half of the CT users are lying. There are still hundreds of users writing stuff like klaviator posted. His description does not cover EVERY situation we can and have faced. But add all the rest and you get a good, very large sample. ADVrider.com even has posters that relate the insurance companies do not consider car tires on motorcycles a significant factor in crash causes. The riders on ADVrider, the Burgman forum and the Darkside Tire Info center tend to be a serious lot with outrageous senses of humor. These riders cover collectively millions of miles, like our John Grinsel, but on car tires. There simply HAS to be something to it! And Ima gonna find out! Thanks again for your concern. Let's see where it leads.....
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My DT300i had Pirelli Diablos 150/70-13 on te rear that lasted 22,000km with a bit of tread left. I ran them at a low 26-28 psi for more surface area.
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. Found out today that 13" car tires virtually non-existant! Must dig some more!
Check Northern Tool for trailer tires.
Kinda pricey, but what the hell, it's only money. :-\
And you only need one. :D
CZ
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Welp, these Kymcos are pretty customizable thats for sure. I might just grab the tire off my lawn tractor and give it a shot, you never know.
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OK, throw a Moon Pie on a blanket, get down there with a camera, or cell phone with flash, and give us a photo of where the beef meets the road on the side stand.
Stig
OK, Stig! Sans moon pie I got a picture! OK, ok, I know! Just use your imagination!
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There you go!
As we can see, you are running on death's edge with that thing.
The adhesion is remarkable...gripping your garage ceiling like that.
You DarkSiders do stretch credibility sometimes..
Thanks for the pic!...
answers a lot of questions.
Stig
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I just spent three days riding twisty roads in the mountains with some other scooter riders. One guy was on a majesty with a car tire. It didn't seem to slow him down any.
(https://photos.smugmug.com/2019-PICS/i-L7h2VTT/1/d1150a76/L/P8190026-L.jpg)
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(https://photos.smugmug.com/2019-PICS/i-TDc2JNs/1/cb2a1c58/L/P8200066-L.jpg)
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Go, Red!
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I just spent three days riding twisty roads in the mountains with some other scooter riders. One guy was on a majesty with a car tire. It didn't seem to slow him down any.
(https://photos.smugmug.com/2019-PICS/i-L7h2VTT/1/d1150a76/L/P8190026-L.jpg)
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(https://photos.smugmug.com/2019-PICS/i-TDc2JNs/1/cb2a1c58/L/P8200066-L.jpg)
Thats over near Skyline, right? Jackson County 33, where they ran the Crow Mountain Hillclimb? Or maybe Jackson County 8 out of Woodville? The turns look familiar.
2008 Majesty, going by the color. I have the same bike, sans the topcase and car tire. I also upgraded to clear front markers with switchback LEDs, LED dash lighting, a tall Cee Bailey screen and the full Malossi transmission kit. Fantastic tourer.
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Those were two different roads, both in North Carolina.
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Meanwhile….
Back to darksiding.
Stig
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Looks like fun Klav!
Dean
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Looks like fun Klav!
Dean
It was a blast!!!
You can check out my ride report here: https://advrider.com/f/threads/full-throttle-touring-150-through-the-rocket-city.647784/page-118#post-38254195 (https://advrider.com/f/threads/full-throttle-touring-150-through-the-rocket-city.647784/page-118#post-38254195)
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Try this article I just found!
https://www.haulnride.com/the-dark-side-the-love-of-car-tires-on-motorcycles (https://www.haulnride.com/the-dark-side-the-love-of-car-tires-on-motorcycles)
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has any one tried a winter tire for the soft rubber for better grip , I could not find one to fit my scooter a 150/ 70 14 with a 4 " rim width, most car tires require 6 " rims or more,. how do you get around that ? the right size rim would cost a fortune if it waS AVAILABLE,. I bumped the cap key,. fat fingers! cant be old?????
I experimented with a winter car tire on my V-strom 1000. I was already using studded tires, drilled stud pockets and inserted conventional auto studs with a pneumatic gun. Front hooked up well,.by the end of 1 season, I'd worn out the rear, front ended up being good for 4 winter seasons (20,000 miles) The car tire was a gamble, didn't even know if it would fit in my swingarm. With 17" wheels, closest outside diameter I could find was a 205/50-17 intended for a 5½-7½" wide wheel , any skinnier 17" tires had low profile and I'd loose too much ground clearance. Bought a General Altimax Arctic, took it too my bike dealer and they put it on for me. Originally, plan was to only run it in winter, but dealer was unwilling to swap it twice a year for me. Ended up running it for 2 full years (40,000 miles) and still 40% tread. I have since acquired a spare rear wheel.
the experiment was SUCCESSFUL BEYOND WY WILDEST IMAGINATION
I can get around in blizzards as good with my V-strom as I can with my Jeep
I used to be one of the naysayers..........I learned my lesson, Mr. Grinsel speaks of all this "experience" he has, but it is worthless if he himself has never ran a car tire on a motorcycle
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Mr Grinsel has had #1 Harley WLA with set of junkyard 18"car tires---changed so bike was rideable, #2 MZ sidecar outfit with 15" special rear rim, offset valve stem, wheel with 2CV tire----legal as sidecar outfit in Germany, against the law solo.....and almost impossible to ride solo.----I also have BSc Safety Degree and worked with MC safety problems for over 40 years, in addition to over 1.5 million bike miles on my own. I say better to stick with what OEM makers recommends for you bike/scooter.
I see only advantage with car tire is long wear-----but most people in US do not ride enough to make any difference in my opinion. 30-40,000 miles a year car tire might make difference. And most do not change and mount their own tires, experiencing the difficulty in seating the beads. If car tires were the way to go, road racers would be using them.
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Road racers occupy the entire performance envelope of their machines and spend a great amount of time in extreme bank angles dragging knees and elbows. A car tire in that scenario would be totally unsatisfactory since it is not capable of supporting traction/adhesion at those angles. Conversely, most of us never get anywhere near the performance limits of our machines and while touring, highway cruising and riding "honey-do's" to the grocer and pharmacy spend most of our sedate riding nearly straight up, cornering at reasonable bank angles (klaviator excepted!) leaving generous "chicken strips" on our oval cycle tires. Clearly, even to the less educated, we have two entirely different performance applications. The only mutual connection is the two wheels on each end of a motorized frame. The racer needs the tire to last the race. The recreation rider needs the tire to outlast the season. And stay within the budget. Now over the years I have learned from many people, some with great, long experience and some nuggets with a fresh outlook. I have learned to listen to a great many people and have learned to ignore many, mostly the ones with closed minds. The most recently ignored was a PhD who was totally off base and totally commited to his ego. He was asked a question he was ignorant of the answer. He was actually ignorant of the fact he was unaware the very thing he believed strongly did not exist in the very book he used as a reference. His ego got in the way of knowledge and truth. He put too much faith in "we always have done it that way" and "that is the policy."
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I see only advantage with car tire is long wear--
nope, car tires are made with rubber that doesn't need to be warmed up for traction, they also put sipes in their tires, real sipes , not make believe sipes that are starting to show up on bike tires.
show me a bike tire that works on snow & ice
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I see only advantage with car tire is long wear-----
I once rode with a guy who was on a Gold Wing with a car tire. His reasons for using a car tire were not longer tire wear. His first reason was that he lived on a dirt road and the car tire worked much better on the dirt road than a MC tire. His second reason was that he mounted a run flat tire. There are no run flat MC tires that I know of.
BTW, I could hear him dragging metal parts trying to stay with me in the curves so the car tire was not holding him back, the bikes cornering clearance, or lack thereof, was. He did admit that on the curvy roads we where riding a MC tire was less effort to ride.
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Try these for original thinking...
http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/TRANSPORT/2wheelcar/2wheelcar.htm (http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/TRANSPORT/2wheelcar/2wheelcar.htm)
Or this...
https://www.wired.com/story/gyro-x-lane-motor-museum/ (https://www.wired.com/story/gyro-x-lane-motor-museum/)
Or THIS you can buy right now if'n you have 70 grand disposable and the "hots" for something unique!
https://www.wired.com/2008/11/monotracer-the/ (https://www.wired.com/2008/11/monotracer-the/)
The POINT of all this is all these schemes were hatched in the imagination, were constucted mostly on the go, cut-and-try until something happened that was close to the original thought. Knew a local guy a few years back, Harrison Crawford, was once a big-shot engineer at Ford, instrumental in the design, manufacture and REFINEMENT of the Falco/Comet/Mustang cars. He told me of a project to reduce the interior noise level in one of the frame and body models at Ford at the time. He said they experimented with hundreds of compunds of rubbery bushings between body and frame. I asked him if this was the essence of "engineering" and he said it was for the most part! Cut-and-try! Experiment!