KymcoForum.com
Scooters - Big Bore => Xciting 500 => Topic started by: Lord Faversham on June 14, 2019, 12:59:26 PM
-
So I went to pull the CVT cover off today. As I was whipping out the bolts, they all came out with copper slip on them which was an encouraging sign, how wrong I was! Can I get the blimmin' CVT belt case cover off? Not a chance. Tried prying it, whacking it with a rubber mallet, whacking the pry points from the other side of the bike and the result and conclusion is that the casing must be stuck on the clutch bearing. Evidently I'm not the first to have this issue as the joint around the case and the case cover is all chewed to beggary where someone else has had a crack at it. (Unsuccessfully I suspect!)
I have movement pretty much all round the casing but it just will not come off. I'm loathe to use the BF&I approach and just try to monster pry it off for fear of cracking the casing as it would be £120 to replace it. I've tried a blow torch on the outside of the bearing housing to see if it would loosen but no joy. Any suggestions? I've bolted the blinking thing back up again for the time being.. >:(
-
Gasket holding it more than the bearing or the two dowel pins. Take it slow, maybe use some solvent on the gasket edge and light taps through the rear wheel spokes to those pry lugs you talked about. Biggest thing is try to evenly part it as best you can. Use a hardwood stick or dowel for that through-spoke drift pin.
-
Yes, hang in there. Those stuck belt covers can be r e a l frustrating to get off.
Eventually I had to tap a thin metal putty knife into the gasket seam of my LIKE200i.....made certain I had a new one to replace it with, first.
Burgman 400's use two bolts threaded through to gently push the cover off and free it from that clutch shaft bearing. Are there any threaded ports that might permit that on a 500 cover?
I lightly greased the new gasket to prevent this the next belt rodeo.
Stig
-
Thanks gents.
There’s no gasket fitted so the case has been off before but the evidence suggests that it’s not been for some time.
I’ve got movement on the dowel pins and all around the case but as I said,it seems to be stuck on the bearing. There are some bolt holes for fixing the plastic covers to the casing so I’m going to fashion a handle of some kind and bolt it to these so I can pull evenly with my feet against the rear wheel. Just hope I don’t knock my teeth out if it comes off all of a sudden!
-
Some heat right there on the cover over that bearing?
You know this - but I've found that even a little bit of mechanical pulling is more successful than a lot of manual pulling. (like those bolts threaded thru the Burgman cover near the bearing....they push it right off) But I understand that it is not always possible.
(Yeah, be careful - the memory of the outcome of pulling a 20 penny ring-shank nail with a crow bar still brings tears to my eyes)
Stuck things can sure mess up a nice afternoon. Brake fluid reservoir screws on a Honda bike or scooter (use proper #2 JIS !!)- foot peg Torx head bolts on a Piaggio, etc., etc.
Good luck......!
Stig
-
Thanks Stig.
Im cogitating the issue. I may try to drill a small hole in the casing by the bearing so I can get on it with the air hose first. The bearing will need replacing anyway now so I’m not bothered about sacrificing it but compressed air might be a better and less damaging way of getting the bearing out of the casing than the BF&I approach. I will keep this thread informed on any progress/failure.
-
So here’s the latest in the stuck casing saga. This is what I tried yesterday after painting up and fitting a centre stand I nabbed off eBay.
A. Copious heat applied to the casing in the vain hope that I could expand the case enough to pull it off the bearing by using two bolts in the case and a couple of mole grips. I pulled like barmy for about 10 minutes with the result being that the case was still stuck on the bearing and the bearing stuck on the shaft, only now I was suitably knackered. On to Plan B.
B. Drilled a small 8mm hole in the case over the bearing seat and jammed the airline in there in the vain hope that I could blow the case off the bearing. Not a chance. Not so much as a smidge of movement.
C. Cut a small circle of casing off immediately over the bearing so I could get at it and introduce some easing oil between the inner race and the shaft, again in the futile hope that I might still be able to pull it off. Nothing.
At this point I was contemplating defeat and resorting to cutting the bleeding thing off the bearing but I still had a couple of shots left at pulling it off before getting to extremes.
D. Drilled and tapped 2 holes either side of the exposed clutch shaft bolt and then machined up a puller which was duly attached to the case this time hoping that I could wind the case off the bearing or shaft. Result? The bolts simply threaded as the case is only about 6-7 mm thick so nowhere near enough meat to bite into.
This had me scratching my head a bit as there should have been some movement by now. So I went and had a look at the parts diagram partly to see how much it was going to set me back for a new casing, Bearing, etc. It would appear the the bearing is retained in its seat by a circlip which would explain the fun I’m having. :o
https://www.bike-parts-kymco.uk/kymco-motorcycle/500-SCOOTER/XCITING/XCITING_500_RI_4T_EURO_III/CRANKCASE/127/9/0/127 (https://www.bike-parts-kymco.uk/kymco-motorcycle/500-SCOOTER/XCITING/XCITING_500_RI_4T_EURO_III/CRANKCASE/127/9/0/127)
So my last shot before trashing the casing is to try to take the clutch bolt off with a windy gun (air impact driver) so I can endeavour to pull the whole assembly off the bike and at least get the case on the bench where I might be able to either drift or cut the bearing out in bits.
Failing that, it’s out with the Dremel and having to place a new casing on order. Still, it has the be done!
In the meantime, I plastic welded the points back on the side panel finishers (notorious for snapping off on removal) and painted them up in matte black and then did the same with the CVT case outer covers. I’ve decided that as the scoot is a 2008 500i model and the plastics need tidying up, I may as well upgrade the styling to the 500Ri spec which is more visually appealing to me. I may start another thread with progress on this aspect. The weather should be a bit better today so I may well have the rest of the inner plastics off and tidy them up too whilst mulling over the stubborn casing issue.
-
Whew!
-
I finally got the b*gger off!
It was a combination of brute force and ignorance (BF&I) and impatience that won the day. I tried the windy gun. Didn't even move the nut so that will no doubt be another part of this unfolding tale....
Given that the next step was going to be trashing the casing by cutting it off, I thought I'd have nothing to lose in beating the hell out of it. Throwing caution and best practice to the wind, rather than use a long wooden dowel and a rubber or brass mallet (It didn't work earlier so unlikely to work again) I resorted to using a long piece of bar and a lump hammer and beat the bejaysus out of the case on the pry points from the opposite side. I must have been getting a tiny bit of movement as the gap around the case opened enough for me to be able to get two dirty great screwdrivers in opposite one another and in line with the bearing. I flooded the area around the race and shaft with easing oil and went and had a cuppa. I came back and then pulled like crazy on both drivers and stone me if it didn't start to move!
I got the thing off and its clear its not been off in a while. The clutch boss that fits into the casing bearing race was pretty corroded and there was no sign of any anti-seize compound which would have been helpful! I'll be able to clean that up I suspect. The bearing race is in good nick ironically but the inner race face which mates with the clutch boss is a little corroded although I may also be able to clean that up. The variator is stepped and the belt isn't reaching the edge fully, the clutch end looks a bit corroded and again there doesn't seem to be full movement on the contra spring both of which would account for the imperfect performance. The windy gun won't shift the bolts on either clutch or variator so I have ordered a removal tool and will get the breaker bar on them both and hope that I don't bend anything!
-
"And Oliver has run himself over!"
Well done, you!
Stig
-
So first off apologies for not updating this as promised. By way of an update on the xciting 500i saga I’m happy to report that it has had the full treatment and is now behaving as it should. Since my last post I’ve been hard at it. I’ve also completely refurbed the scoot too. [emoji12]
It started as this (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190629/7f27d2f85aea3aff21fd3482dde2041b.jpg)
All the plastics have been taken off, repaired where they were cracked and then prepped and repainted in 500R colours.
The engine has been given a full service - oil and filter, air filter, tranny fluid, valve clearances and a new PAIR pipe.
It’s had a new Mivv catalysed exhaust, new Kymco clutch and Dr Pulley sport vario and 30g sliders. The front forks have been painted as have the rear fork and all the callipers which have also had an overhaul together with the wheels. .
The upshot of all this graft is a pretty much new looking scoot which now tops out at just over an indicated ton (where legally permissible of course) and is quick off the lights too. It sits quite happily twos up at the legal motorway limit and the new CVT has made this a very relaxed affair. (Big thanks to Dirk and the team at Mr Pulley for getting it to me in fast time).
All of this just in time for me to take her Ladyship away for a weeks sojourn in La Belle France in our motorhome behind which we will be towing the scoot so we have something to zip around on whilst we’re out there.
Road tests all completed, nothing amiss and all systems now fully functional.
It now looks like this and goes like a stabbed rat:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190629/6a3ba0b096aa10d0412e80c3a2f9587c.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Good show! Absolutely stunning. I dub thee now the 500 expert!
-
It all started with a stuck belt cover!
When he free'd it - all heck broke loooose.
What a nice job!
Safe journey - and please take snaps.
Stig
-
Thanks fellas. Pix to be forthcoming. Watch this space!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Very nice job. Well done.
Sent from my Mi Max using Tapatalk
-
That's looking gorgeous. It's always nice to see work done to a high standard :)
-
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190703/42f55c291c61bb510aa4e7fa9b04f6c9.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190703/e8bf01f90e81e4f42becd439f2be470e.jpg)
As promised, a couple of pics from our travels. More to come!
In just over 1000 miles of travel on the trailer, the only gripe I have is that the rear straps have chafed the new paint on the rear covers. You can hardly notice it, but I’ll have to repaint them again when we get back. [emoji849]
I think one of these is necessary.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190703/794fa800543e011765a94122789855f7.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Thanks Viper
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Very nice!
Thanks for sharing.
Great looking out fit - not seen a camper like that here in the colonies.
Stig
-
So the fun continues [emoji849]
On my first trip out on the scoot to get cash from the local ATM and I’m backing up to manoeuvre it out of the parking space I was in, pulled on the left hand linked brake and CRAC! (French spelling). Next thing I hear is the tinkle of the brake pad backing plates hitting the deck.
Turns out, one of the sliders on the rear brake calliper carrier sheared clean through and everything fell out apart from the pads which are held in place by the retaining pin. Damn good job that it didn’t happen 2-up at 70mph I guess.
I managed to buy some tools to get the calliper off (after staggering around the local village in 40 degree heat with Kevlar jeans on - Betty Swollocks doesn’t come close.......) and I jury rigged a fix so that the rear calliper was safely held away from the rear wheel so at least I could get the scoot back to the campsite whereupon I limped it back with just front brakes.
Unfortunately this means our movements have been curtailed somewhat with her Ladyship and I restricted to the campsite. This is no hardship really other than having to go get supplies daily. Use of the scoot is therefore restricted to yours truly pottering gently down to the local supermarket (and no further) to stock up on food, taking it very steady. Thankfully the roads here in rural France are very quiet.
I tried to source spares and a replacement calliper to fix it whilst away but the fastest they could be couriered to me is the day we are due to leave, so little point really. I’ll therefore wait until we get home to fix it.
Best laid plans of mice and men etc....
Bugger.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Well shee-oot! (Latin sp.) that is a bummer. Yes, could have been much worse.
The Brake Angel seems to favor scooter owners - brake lines blew out on my Chevy F-150 while backing 30 feet out of my level driveway. 3 mins later I would have been braking at a T intersection with 50mph cross traffic.
Glad you are still aboard here...
Had a Jetta drop the glued-on pad one day...but 3 other wheels working. Very strange noise!
Hang in there....reading a book about the 2003 heat wave in France. Horrible situation.
Safe travels,
Stig
-
Having been in France in 2003 I can honestly say that this year feels as hot but maybe the duration is not so bad. I’ve certainly never known it previously as hot in the Dordogne as it is now.
If I recall some 15000 people died in France that year due to complications from the heat (your book may correct me on that fact). The only upside was that 2003 was a fantastic year for French wine.
I do remember that when we got back to Blighty after our holliers in 2003, the summer was long and hot in the Uk too and has yet to be bested.
Thankfully the weather is set to turn cooler for our return trip next week which will make things more bearable.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
-
Well back all in one piece and new parts ordered up together with the official decal set. I'll report back on progress once installed!
Faversham
-
Bit of an update. Since our return from France I’ve been flat out at work and on the odd occasion when I have been at home, the weather has been decidedly inclement. Not much chance of me getting the job done this side of September it seems but I will update with pics when done.
Faversham.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
So it’s been a while and life has gotten in the way but I thought I’d give a bit of an update. After last years fast and furious rebuild of the Xciting 500 I’d left it for a while. I wasn’t happy with the paint so I repainted the plastics I’d repaired with some 2 pack gloss white. A few decals later, a bit of tuning and a few new parts and the scoot is now looking and driving (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200816/618b2a7b958c69d8d5c03758516cfbc6.jpg)
the part.
Very happy with this scoot. It goes like the clappers (now) and is a big comfortable thing that even Her Ladyship is happy to grace with her arse. Bit of a departure from the starting point (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200816/fcff59000559e07a50c00d5c0803dc9a.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Can I just reiterate the paean of praise old bean. Spiffing job. Hope her Ladyship is suitably grateful.
The respray sets it off nicely.
-
Very well, m'Lord! Wondered what happened to you and you have been busy! I have been looking for my sword I had while in Naval Service to properly dub the forum resident expert on 500 cc two-wheelers! You are one of the fine examples of the renowned English tenacity.
By the way, there are a bunch of your lads on your Isles that are building forms to lay up a new fuselage for a WWII Mosquito aeroplane. The group has a facebook page as "The People's Mosquito Group." Apparently, the wings and tail surfaces are intact but the fuselage had structural compromises. Big project. Much tenacity...
-
Thank you gentlemen. High praise indeed!
Needless to say, I haven’t quite finished it. There are still some gewgaws to yet go on: I’ve ordered some red anodised brake reservoir tops, shortie adjustable levers and bar end weights which should be here soon.
I’m also going to swap out the standard 500i screen for the lower blacked out Ri screen too for no other reason that the old one is a bit crazed and it would be a shame to spoil the sheep for a ha’p’orth of tar.
I’ll have to stop replacing bits on it soon as If I carry on it will end up like Trigger’s Broom at this rate!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
I’ll have to stop replacing bits on it soon as If I carry on it will end up like Trigger’s Broom at this rate!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
You may need to explain that reference for our American cousins. Don't think Only Fools was a big hit over there?....
-
I worked closely with a sweet girl from Hull, U.K., for 8 years. English-lit major working on her masters while here... - so language wasn't a complete lost cause between us.
"She's thick as two planks!"....when describing our head nurse.....which morphed into, "Yeah, he's thick as.."
We became like brother and sister....which proved that two (married) people can have a platonic relationship.
I taught her to enjoy good coffee. She never got me to enjoy tea. Strangly, she'd go for a hot cup of tea on the hottest days...both of us sweating like heck.
Stig
-
Yep, there's a view over here that hot tea cools you down on a hot day?... Never seen it myself Stig. Sooner have a cold beer or even chilled water.
-
I must confess, I never really bought into the idea of a hot cup of tea on a warm day in order to cool down. It allegedly makes you sweat which then is wicked away by the breeze supposedly giving a cooling effect. Frankly, I’m not convinced. I always found that the heat of the tea trumped any cooling. I suspect it’s a throwback to our days of Empire when tea drinking was seen as pretty much a panacea for anything ranging from a minor malaise to having a leg off.
Neil to your point, I suspect you’re right about the reference to Triggers Broom. So for those unfamiliar with the concept, it’s an amusing interpretation of the Ship Of Theseus paradox, whimsically recreated in one of our better comedic exports.
Enjoy chaps.
https://youtu.be/LAh8HryVaeY
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
So, as promised, herewith some pics of the aforementioned anodised trinkets which now adorn the bars of my scoot. The adjustable levers are very comfy and allow me to use just a couple of digits to brake rather than the whole handful and I rather like the effect as I think they give the scoot a bit of a rakish air.
What think ye chaps?
-
Nice & judicious application of the anodised gee gaws there m'lud. Gives me an idea should the Xciting acquisition masterplan ever come to fruition.
-
I added adjustable levers to my Forza, but never saw the advantage of braking with 2 fingers rather than 4?
It's not like you're resting the other two to join the game later.
I DO like a fluid reservoir out in the open!
Encourages more attention to keeping the proper amount of fresh fluid in there. It is difficult to even see the sight glass on too many scooters.
(https://i.postimg.cc/fLKDg20J/16bagsy.jpg)
Stig
-
I added adjustable levers to my Forza, but never saw the advantage of braking with 2 fingers rather than 4?
Stig, I'm sure you already know this but the '2 finger' braking comes from riding your bike with your first two fingers on the brake lever (at all times) and your thumb, ring and pinkie fingers gripping the throttle. That way you can activate the front brake in a split second or even better, you can light up your brake light any time you let up on the throttle to warn those behind you.
The braking difference comes in the short time it would take you to remove all 4 fingers from the throttle to grab the lever vs always having 2 fingers on the lever. At higher speeds the extra 20-50 (?) feet shorter stopping distance could very well save your life. With small hands it's hard to do this without adjustable levers.
-
Stig, I'm sure you already know this but the '2 finger' braking comes from riding your bike with your first two fingers on the brake lever (at all times) and your thumb, ring and pinkie fingers gripping the throttle. That way you can activate the front brake in a split second or even better, you can light up your brake light any time you let up on the throttle to warn those behind you.
The braking difference comes in the short time it would take you to remove all 4 fingers from the throttle to grab the lever vs always having 2 fingers on the lever. At higher speeds the extra 20-50 (?) feet shorter stopping distance could very well save your life. With small hands it's hard to do this without adjustable levers.
Well Jim, (bear with me - this week daughter & I must call everyone Jim, incl. ea. other :)*
I never ride with 2 fingers on the lever.
I think I might have years ago - but my first winter riding with the bulk of battery heated liners under thick leather gauntlets made that a non starter for my leisurely rides out on country roads.
At 19°F, using no screen - I have to keep things simple.
Every time I tried (years ago) it felt too awkward. Now I just ride with 4-on-the-floor, so to speak.
I was periodically lighting all my rear LEDs on the foggy/foggy ride home the other day. To illuminate me presence!
But I just did it with the weakest brake, the rear, which hardly slows the scoot.
(https://i.postimg.cc/wTdzKzTr/P1020861-2.jpg)
However, you make a very good case for riding with 2 fingers in one position and 3 in another. I hope people take your advice.
Major Jim
* Last week it was "Steve"
-
I must admit that all my previous means of two-wheeled perambulation had standard levers, the enormous size of which forced the use of the full set of digits. (I don’t have particularly small hands, just short fingers - go figure).
The X500 with its new accoutrements is the first modum onerariis I have owned where the ability to use just two fingers is far removed from the archetypal English insult and is very much a form of comfort in my advancing years.
If as Jim suggests it can help to reduce reaction time, I’m thinking that as old age and senility takes a firm hold, anything that can offset this degeneration can only be a good thing. It’s taking some getting used to but I shall persevere....!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
I've just started riding with 2 fingers always on the brake, this year. I read an article in (can't remember the name..some motorcycle magazine) that laid out in great detail the benefits of this...but it makes perfect sense if we can eliminate that brief delay when moving all fingers from throttle to brake..how many feet do we cover in that short time? who knows..but anything to shorten our stops and keep us alive is good enough for me!
I'm also making a conscious effort to ever so slightly activate my brake light when I release the throttle, alerting those behind me of my intentions. I can probably ride without using brakes if I really want to but that doesn't help keep me from being rear ended as most car drivers are paying little attention...so lighting up the brake light is a good warning.
It's still taking some getting used to with the 2 fingers on the brake (no adjustable levers on the scoot so it's more difficult for me...but motorcycle has adjustable shorty levers so it's easier). With anything, practice makes it easier.
-
Persevere Hawk, it will become second nature. I've been riding this way ever since being introduced to it during advanced training back in the 80's.
-
So this week I’ve been treating the old girl to a few more goodies. I also bought some new trinkets for the scoot too!
Not that I drive too demonstrably when out and about, I do happen upon the occasion to have to use the scoot’s horn from time to time. Sadly in its standard trim it’s not so much asthmatic as it is reminiscent of a muted duck fart.
Not wishing to muck about with adding in extra relays in order to add one of the amusing truck horns that the YouTube fraternity seem to find so amusing, I’ve plumped for a smaller upgrade in the form of a Denali Sound Bomb Mini. It sounds a little hooliganesque in it’s description but hopefully will be a sufficient improvement.
I’ve also shelled out on a USB port and RAM mount to be able to mount my phone atop the instrument binnacle. It’s current position mounted on a mirror stem obscures the instruments and means I have to take my eye off the road too far.
I’ll fit all these when my new windscreen arrives from France and I have cause to pull the front end and floorboards off all in one go.
Pics of the finished job in due course but for now here are said trinkets ready for adornment. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200911/7abe6b71fdc3febd4dfad4a63ce05b5b.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200911/409ba382ecadc3611b1858f5ab1a359e.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk