KymcoForum.com
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: preacher son on October 23, 2018, 04:01:37 PM
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2009 MXU 150, 1500 miles on it, bought for my gdaughter. It will not pull a small hill from dead stop. Been looking for answers and all lead to clutch
When i pulled cover off there was oil in the clutch case, everything i saw was this is suppose to be dry. Am i right or wrong? Possible seal or bearing gone bad?
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I've a scooter...but sure don't think that there is supposed to be oil on the workings under that CVT belt cover. Engine or gear oil from front or rear shaft seal leaking into the area it sounds like. Unless leaking into the cover from above?? Airfilter flooded?....but those covers are usually very well sealed to keep water out.
Stig
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Thanks for reply Stig. After pulling clutch and belt i cleaned everything best i could and sanded the clutch fiber shoes and cleaned the bell housing. Put back together and test drove, no doubt that is suppose to be dry. Im thinkin coming from engine or tranny shaft. I got to get a compact to get the front pully off.............of course LOL. Dont ya love it when you buy something for a great price only to find out why when ya get home LOL Oh wellllllll
Preacher Son
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It for sure comes either from engine- or tranny shaft. So it´s either dirty Motor- or clean Gearoil. And it´s expectable and quiet normal after nine year of not using/riding it.
1500miles is literally nothing in nine years. Expect other plastic- and rubber parts also to be worn out or maybe at the end of it´s lifespan.
Seals wear not only by not being lubed with regulary usage but also by aging with the years. Also depends on the quality of the seals of course.
And if I were you I would change both shaft seals at the same time not only the actually leaking one... ;) Good investment into the future.
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Thanks vespbretta, good advice and i will take it.
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The good news is that scooter engines are relatively easy to split in half and get to the crank, once you get the variator off. It'll probably just be the gasket set and seals, which aren't expensive.
Best of luck with sorting it out!
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Welp i tell ya Viper i have never enjoyed splitting cases, thats more involved then i care for but sometimes ya aint got a choice lol
I picked this atv up for 500 guess i cant complain, already went a round with the cid? that powers the starter. When i got it there was a button cut in to side going directly to the solenoid. I traced the wires, cut loose from cdi and wired solenoid direct to battery, now the handlebar button works starter again. The lights are also not getting power but she dont ride at night. Same thing with the steering plastic bushing that was missing. I made my own
Finding 'affordable' parts seems to be the challenge here.
Reminds me of my Harley chopper days LOL
Preacher Son
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the crankshaft seal leaking. It happened to me. The engine does not have to be torn down to replace and install a new one.
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Thank you boo, you just made my day, i was starting to think about liquid nail LMAO
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the crankshaft seal leaking. It happened to me. The engine does not have to be torn down to replace and install a new one.
That's great news! How do you do it?
The bad news is that I've clearly done this unnecessarily in the past :|
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That's great news! How do you do it?
The bad news is that I've clearly done this unnecessarily in the past :|
Viper, when my GT was fairly new, it had oil in the variator housing. It was dripping on my garage floor. I took it to the dealer where I bought it. At the time it was under warranty. They inspected it and told me it was the crank seal leaking. They said this happens even with new scoots some times. They have a way of pulling the old seal and tapping a new one in. I did not watch them do it but, I did ask them if they had to tear the engine apart to do the job. They said no. It was not too much of a job. They said it took as long to remove and replace the variator housing as it did to replace the seal. Wish I could have been there to watch the procedure. I assumed they used a hook and slider tool to remove the damaged seal.
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Viper, when my GT was fairly new, it had oil in the variator housing. It was dripping on my garage floor. I took it to the dealer where I bought it. At the time it was under warranty. They inspected it and told me it was the crank seal leaking. They said this happens even with new scoots some times. They have a way of pulling the old seal and tapping a new one in. I did not watch them do it but, I did ask them if they had to tear the engine apart to do the job. They said no. It was not too much of a job. They said it took as long to remove and replace the variator housing as it did to replace the seal. Wish I could have been there to watch the procedure. I assumed they used a hook and slider tool to remove the damaged seal.
Yeah, I've seen at least one video of them being pulled and re-seated on a scooter. Might have been on the Burgman forum. Apparently not a big deal at all. No case splitting needed.
Stig
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Awesome knowledge at work! Thanks all.
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Finally got my air impact wrench so will be on this project soon. Need to order seal before i tear it apart so my grand daughter can ride it over Thanksgiving. I have it cleaned up enough she will be fine for a little bit. Will post my experience when i get it done ;)
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It is important to know exactly where the oil is coming from.
Take the variator housing off. Clean the inside good. Ride the scoot and get the oil hot. Park it and watch for drips or runs.
On a side note, the axle housing is vented into the variator housing through the breather filter. If the axle housing has had an excess amount of oil put in it, it can burp the oil into the air filter saturating it. That in turn will put oil in your variator housing. Just something to check. At least that is how it is on my GT.
Good luck.
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Take a look at Stigs post in the tech section about the Lisle seal removal tool. He posted a great video on the tool and removal and replacement of a new seal. It is a good video.
Turns a scary job into a simple one.
Home Depot has this tool listed and it is not expensive.
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Is the hose from the head hanging free over the cover.The over flow hose might be dripping oil in the case.
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I will take all this advice, i did get the engine seal in mail today, not sure what the head hose is all about but i will look. Thanks for all info fellers ;)
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I will take all this advice, i did get the engine seal in mail today, not sure what the head hose is all about but i will look. Thanks for all info fellers ;)
Please let us know how everything shakes out. We learn from each other that way.
Good luck. boo
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Will do boo. Im waiting for my gkids next visit to be over during thanksgiving before i work on it, i have it cleaned up enough she can have some fun. THEN..............it will be time for me to have some fun LOL
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@boo
I don´t understand your 3rd last sentence from page 1. Why would Gear Oil come from the airfilter housing into the variator housing, if the variator housing is or at least should be sealed enough to prevent oil, water, dirt getting in there? In my humble opinion there is no direct connection between airfilter housing and variator housing and there shouldn´t be one - ever. And if a sealing was used correctly, even with some Oil dripping, this shouldn´t be an issue in there.
Or is there anything else I haven´t understood yet. :-\
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vespbretta i will make an attempt to answer that question, now ya got to understand im an old harley guy and never had one of these critters before so may not get the part names right
The clutch housing has a large hose that goes from the back of housing around the tranny to other side of atv and up into the breather housing where the air is sucked past a filter for carb.
There is also a hose on front of clutch housing that goes to front of and on top of atv for sucking air thru a filter to the housing. Kinda strange and im guessing this might be a way to keep clutch cool and feed air to carb. Sure a round about way of doing it. Id like to block both hoses off and filter the hole in the carb air box for draw but afraid i might mess it up
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Ah, now I see a bit clearer. Firstly we are talking about an ATV - I must have missed that, and secondly these ATVs obviously do have a totally different breather system than scooters do. Sounds somewhat strange to me, but anyway. I have never seen an ATV in a close up.
Maybe because they are more often ridden and submerged in mud and water and sludge they have this special breathing systems.
Well then, sorry for my statements. Good luck with your analysis and repairs. 8) :)
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@boo
I don´t understand your 3rd last sentence from page 1. Why would Gear Oil come from the airfilter housing into the variator housing, if the variator housing is or at least should be sealed enough to prevent oil, water, dirt getting in there? In my humble opinion there is no direct connection between airfilter housing and variator housing and there shouldn´t be one - ever. And if a sealing was used correctly, even with some Oil dripping, this shouldn´t be an issue in there.
Or is there anything else I haven´t understood yet. :-\
On the 300 GTI, the rear axle housing is vented into the variator housing via a tube. I have mine disconnected because I think it is a dumb idea. The blow-by fumes from the rear axle are vented to the area in and around the air filter. If one puts too much oil in the rear axle housing, it will burp the excess oil into the air filter saturating it with oil which will in turn drip oil into the variator housing.
ps: Oil does not come from the air filter housing. It comes from the rear axle housing to the area of the air filter. That is where the problem comes from. Oil blown in or burped into the air filter. Air filter gets saturated then drips oil in and on variator components.
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Thanks boo. I just tried to find some exploded views of these assembly parts for better understanding. But failed for the GT300i.
Anyway, I understand the most of what you are explaining. If I understood you right, your scooter does have TWO breather hoses. ONe goes directly into the drivetrain to the clutch (which is indeed strange) and the other one into the airfilter housing. Right?
Fortunately my scooter (Like 200i) does have only ONE breather hose coming from the rear axle gearbox and going directly into the airfilter housing.
And that´s most probably right that way and a good thing, because I want this blow by fumes hose opening be protected from water and dirt. The best place to achieve this imho, might be the airfilter housing. Doesn´t it? Don´t want to have water and dirt/sand in my gearbox.
Of course there might be a problem with excess gear oil in there when overfilling the gearbox. Hence overfilling should never be done. ;)
I always use(d) synth gear oil and never overfill(ed). And therefore never have and had the slightest problems, either with oilfoam , fume or excess oil itself. :-)
So, even if there was an overfilling going on and some oil came into the airfilter housing, it shouldn´t have a harmful effect on the drivetrain. In my case there is no connection from the gearbox to the drivetrain whatsoever.
The oil maybe could only drop down from the airfilter housing to the outside of the drivetrain housing doing no harm, except making a oily mess and dripping further to the ground. And the drivetrain housings should be connected via a rubber or paper gasket, so that no oil, water or dirt can get in there.
But I understand, that different vehicles might have different systems and solutions here, which I dont know yet and never have seen.
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Please let us know how everything shakes out. We learn from each other that way.
Good luck. boo
Well boo here i am 10 months later and got it done. Its amazing how things get put on the back burner over and over. I did get the atv fixed this week. Replaced crank and trans seals that are located behind the belt. I had to buy a air impact to get the crank nut off but i needed one anyway.
i also bought a seal remover off ebay for 5.00, very handy little tool. Everything was oiled up again causing belt to slip so i cleaned all parts and replaced seals.
The struggle was more in finding the parts and finding them at affordable price. One dealer told me it would take a month for parts, i backed out which im glad cause he was wrong on what the seal numbers were. Two seals and a gasket from him was going to be 80.00.
After i pulled the seals i measured and did a search for seals that size and found them. I made my own gasket, both seals and gasket cost me 27.00 ;D Thats what im takin about :)
So my gdaughter's atv is up and running again now im looking at spacing out the rear tires. This thing is so narrow its unstable as far as im concerned. Also the head light black box or what ever it is burned out and lights wont work, im going to rewire them from the battery to a fuse to the lights. To heck with these 100.00 relay things Kymco uses
I did the same with the starter, went around all that fancy crap and hit the battery it works great.
Sorry it took so long to get back on the project but here it be ;)