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General => General Discussion => Topic started by: boo on July 05, 2017, 02:04:13 PM
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Cities in Asia are planning to ban scooters in the near future. Hanoi plans to ban scooters by 2030, citing congestion and pollution. People there cannot afford cars. This does not make sense to me. Scooters pollute much, much less than cars. How will people get around if they are banned?.
Also 13 cities in China have plans to ban scooters in the future. None of this makes sense to me. I would think it would be more practical to ban cars.
IMHO these bans would be devastating to scooter manufactures around the world.
What do you think?. Could these bans be a death nell for scooters?.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v434/ice1/hanoi%20motorbikes_7369145_ver1.0_640_360_zpswmivr02k.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/ice1/media/hanoi%20motorbikes_7369145_ver1.0_640_360_zpswmivr02k.jpg.html)
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Bad news :'(
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All of Asia's people struck me as immensely practical folks. This sounds more like some socialist-communist bright idea which will not work.
Karl
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There seems to be a drive to make us all electric I fear
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Urban public transport better step up.
Saw plenty examples of mass transport in the rural areas of VN.....3 wheel Lambrettas with 22 people, a couple pigs ,several crates of chickens wobbling down the roads at top speed.
Stig
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There seems to be a drive to make us all electric I fear
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The last time I was in Taiwan was 2013. Same trip Hong Kong and Beijing.
There is no question that China would love to have electric trans at any cost. They have never worried about oppressing their own.
Of course this from the people who give us exploding lithium ion batts....
AMAC
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The last time I was in Taiwan was 2013. Same trip Hong Kong and Beijing.
There is no question that China would love to have electric trans at any cost. They have never worried about oppressing their own.
Of course this from the people who give us exploding lithium ion batts....
And soon electric Volvos.
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A lot of the scooters in Asia are 2 stroke and do produce a lot of pollution. I recall seeing what looked like a huge pile of pulled rice moving along a road in S. E. Asia. Since the drivers's hat was made from the same stuff, you had to look hard to see a set of eyes peering out on the side that was going forward. The Honda 50cc bikes with big wheels were especially popular. Not unusual to see whole families traveling on one of them. I will believe scooters will be banned in Asia when I see it happen.
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A lot of the scooters in Asia are 2 stroke and do produce a lot of pollution...
I wonder if the bans will be two strokes and/or bikes older than XX like they did in Paris, or if they'll try to ban them all.
https://rideapart.com/articles/got-old-bike-stay-paris (https://rideapart.com/articles/got-old-bike-stay-paris)
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I been thinkin' about this, Boo, and I really have a hard time accepting the story line. Bloomberg in NYC yes, anywhere in Asia, no.
Karl
PS: I have been wrong before! And you pukes know it!
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You know, after looking at that picture, I agree with you boo. What if all those people on scooters were able to afford cars?? I would think that a ban on scooters would be the government pushing for mass transit, which they would run and profit from. Whatda you think?
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It is time to clean up those engines ,. Desmodromic valve train like yager 200 is wishing for,. the idea has been around for ever,. and large engines has it for a long time, just think 100 MPG for scooters,. and 20 to 30 percent more power,.
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Banning new two strokes should have happened yesterday.
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Banning new two strokes should have happened yesterday.
Unless they can find a way to make them run as clean as a modern 4stroke.
The truth is that the air in China is nasty. And those MANY thousands of dirty two stokes add up.
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If the Chinese built scooters over there are of the same quality as the average Chinese scooter over here, banning NEW two strokes will result in Nearly all of them being off the road in just a couple of years. Lol.
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of polluting 2 cycle engines but, a total ban, why?. Scooters are practical transportation for the masses in poor countries.
Surely this is an idle threat.
Dedee, I know Ducati uses desmodromic valves on their motorcycles but, I don`t understand what this has to do with pollution.
If these countries actually ban motor scooters, it might be enough to kill the scooter industry. People in poor counties buy scooters by the hundreds of thousands.
Personally I don`t want this to happen. I want future generations to enjoy scootering as much as I do.
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I expect they'd revert to bicycles, not buy cars.
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I expect they'd revert to bicycles, not buy cars.
After thinking about it for awhile, what you say makes sense.
That is probably what those governments have in mind.
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You know, after looking at that picture, I agree with you boo. What if all those people on scooters were able to afford cars?? I would think that a ban on scooters would be the government pushing for mass transit, which they would run and profit from. Whatda you think?
You are probably right. Mass transit and bicycles.
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this electric cycle and car thing. They will have to get the electricity from somewhere. Coal fired steam plants or nuclear. They are big polluters too.
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Here's an interesting chart for the United States, showing how efficient a gas powered "mid-sized" car needs to be so that it's equivalent to an electric vehicle: http://www.ucsusa.org/sites/default/files/images/2015/11/vehicles-m-emissions-map-with-notes.jpg (http://www.ucsusa.org/sites/default/files/images/2015/11/vehicles-m-emissions-map-with-notes.jpg) (In the case the link breaks, the range is 35mpg to 135mpg)
I seem to remember (from Mythbusters) that while motorcycles produce fewer emissions overall than cars, the amount of non-CO2 emissions is actually much higher. So less greenhouse gases, but much more toxic / smog-producing molecules.
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Sort of related, here's a bit by Douglas Adams on bicycles in China in the 80's:
"Everyone in China rides bicycles. Private cars are virtually unheard of, so the traffic in Shanghai consists of trolley-buses, taxis, vans, trucks and tidal waves of bicycles.
The first time you stand at a major intersection and watch, you are convinced that you are about to witness major carnage. Crowds of bicycles are converging on the intersection from all directions. Trucks and trolley-buses are already barrelling across it. Everyone is ringing a bell or sounding a horn and no one is showing any signs of stopping. At the moment of inevitable impact you close your eyes and wait for the horrendous crunch of mangled metal but, oddly, it never comes.
It seems impossible. You open your eyes. Several dozen bicycles and trucks have all passed straight through each other as if they were merely beams of light.
Next time you keep your eyes open and try to see how the trick's done; but however closely you watch you can't untangle the dancing, weaving patterns the bikes make as they seem to pass insubstantially through each other, all ringing their bells."
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Yes, I've seen this in S.E. Asia. My daughter just returned from the Netherlands, where there is a lot of bicycle traffic. Very few cars. She said the air was filled with bells. She said if you hear a bell behind you, as you are walking, you had to move out of the way because bicycles have the right -of-way.
I was in Germany in the late 60's deactivating army units for re-deployment to VN and noticed that all factories had huge bicycle hang up sheds and very small auto parking lots. As a side note, the countries who use bicycles as a primary source of transportation have the healthiest population.