KymcoForum.com
Scooters - 125 to 300 => Downtown 300 => Topic started by: Snorvey on April 02, 2017, 03:56:25 PM
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Havign finally got the cover of with the help of a very large rubber persuader, i got a look at the drive belt today. I was worried that it might be on the way out as there was a screeching noise coming from that area after quite a number of miles. It hasn't repeated itself since then, but most of my journeys have been relatively short (less than 20 miles).
I don't know much about drive belts, so I look a few pics and a few measurements while I was it at. Any thoughts would be most welcome.
The belt itself would appear to be as new. There are no cracks or missing teeth. The maximum deflection when pushed is about half an inch (should have measured this more accurately, I know). Measured over several different points, the belt is 22 mm wide and at it's narrowest (at the tip of the teeth, its 16mm). The cogs etc all seem to be in good condition.
As I said, any thoughts (particularly in relation of the screeching when warm) would be appreciated.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3804/33639109112_00b901a85c_c.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2844/33639101212_6bf542d7b0_c.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3927/33754443076_43bf083c13_c.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3931/33639086622_23451b2fa8_c.jpg)
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How many miles on the belt?
What are specs for new belt per your manual, and limit of wear?
Will you be cleaning pulley surfaces?
Stig
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mitsuboshi spec sheet 2011 length 1004 mm. width 25.5 angle 30 degree 2011 downtown to now,. did not see what the minimum width is, I think it is 23 mm. , all belts I have bought are 24.3 wide ,. the way to check belt is to take it off, and flex the belt to see if there are cracks showing in between the cogs inside and outside ,. you can use the boss to bend the belt too check for cracks, so you don't over bend it,.
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Snorvey, The screeching sound is the same sound that tires make on pavement when you use too much power and the rubber breaks loose and spins the tire. (lost grip) As Stig some rightly mentioned, cleaning the face plates will help. Belts do stretch and you need to know the defection limit. The only part of the belts thats contacting the face plates are the edges. As the belt wears it becomes more narrow and there fore increasing the deflection. The teeth do not contact anything and are only there to aid in cooling the belt. A cvt generates a lot of heat and the ventilation inside the belt housing must be un-obstructed. In the pictures, the belt looked good, but could be worn enough to make it slip. Don't know if any of the helps, but that's the low down on all CTV drive belts.
cheers
Mac
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Thanks lads. You know what, i think I'm going to order myself a new belt. I'm quite happy to fit it myself, but i recall you need a special pulley holding tool make things a bit easier?
Also, cleaning the pulley surfaces.... With what? Degreaser? Or just a soft cloth?
Thanks again.
Ps the service manual says the belt was changed (or inspected - the book just had a tick next to 'inspect/replace belt') 4500 miles ago - before i bought it. I think for peace of mind, I'll change it.
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when you get new belt measure it with tailors tape should be about 1004 MM. width 24.5 MM. or more,
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As far as what to clean the two sides of each pulley with. I'd use 70% rubbing alcohol. It dries completely and leaves no residue and will remove any oil. Do that while the old belt is off.
Mac
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I've seen a telly program on the Discovery Channel that shows them making 70% alcohol - normally in the middle of the night in a hut in the middle of the forest. Guaranteed to get your sight back within 3 days.
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I've seen a telly program on the Discovery Channel that shows them making 70% alcohol - normally in the middle of the night in a hut in the middle of the forest. Guaranteed to get your sight back within 3 days.
in Canada we call it Nufi screech, USA call it white lightning
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That possibly cannot be an original belt.
Maybe that is why it is screeching.
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At 22 MM. wide it probabley is bottoming out, on the boss, slipping on the variator faces
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That possibly cannot be an original belt.
I didn't see any Kymco logos on it or anything, so you're probably right. OEM parts for me all the way now.
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The tell tale sign is that original Kymco belts are single sided.
That possibly cannot be an original belt.
I didn't see any Kymco logos on it or anything, so you're probably right. OEM parts for me all the way now.
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That's quite a tell tale sign! Thanks.
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My genuine Kymco DT belt says 'Kymco' and 'Mitsuboshi' and is toothed on both sides. Your belt may be slipping since it is too worn out on the inner side, causing it to taper and ride lower in the pulleys. This will affect grip, acceleration and top speed.
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The belt appears to be serviceable, clean sheaves as described and enjoy more miles on your scooter.
If you are a service fanatic, definitely install a new OEM belt after cleaning, saving this one as a spare.
Throwing more money at any situation does inspire confidence.
redk
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I have the same thing before and after replacing the drive belt. Short, screech when starting, but it has to be hot. The interior was surprisingly clean and the variation pulley faces where smooth and shiny.
The next time I change the belt, I am going to rough up the variatior pulley faces with 600 emery cloth.
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Short, screech when starting, but it has to be hot
Yes - and in my case only after 80+ miles plus constant.
As I have been only using the scoot for short commutes of late, the problem hasn't recurred.
Therefore, there isn't a problem :-)
P.S. not sure roughing up anything with with emery paper is a good idea - look at what happened to Ol' 2 Wheels :-)
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Snorvey, what happened to Ole Two Wheels??
Ole two wheels
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I don't know what happened to "ole two Wheels", but Snorvey is correct about putting any abrasive on the belt sheaves . At the most. all you would do is speed up your belt wear and possibly cause jerky starts. Those sheaves are suppose to be smooth, shiny and un groved. Just my thoughts.
Mac, aka "Ole Two Wheels"
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Evening Mac.
Lots of love from Bonnie Scotland.
.... And it's a holiday weekend!
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We got us a holiday weekend here also Our's is call Memorial Day and is observed on Monday. What the holiday over there for?? Or are you going on holiday. If memory severs, The English say they are going on Holiday when they take leave of work for a week or so and we call it taking a vacation. Anyway, what ever it's for, have a great holiday.
Mac
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We got us a holiday weekend here also Our's is call Memorial Day and is observed on Monday. What the holiday over there for?? Or are you going on holiday. If memory severs, The English say they are going on Holiday when they take leave of work for a week or so and we call it taking a vacation. Anyway, what ever it's for, have a great holiday.
happy birthday for the queen in the UK, and canada
Mac
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We got us a holiday weekend here also Our's is call Memorial Day and is observed on Monday. What the holiday over there for?? Or are you going on holiday. If memory severs, The English say they are going on Holiday when they take leave of work for a week or so and we call it taking a vacation. Anyway, what ever it's for, have a great holiday.
Mac
It's the Spring Bank Holiday Monday' according to my diary.
For the English (down south), that normally means getting up at 4am on Saturday morning and sitting in a motorway traffic jam for 8 hours on their way to the seaside.
For the Scottish, we normally head down to the pub for some al fresco (weather permitting!) alcohol imbibing.
Have a good one yourself!
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I ordered a new drive belt today - a Mitsuboshi item to replace the cheapo pattern part that currently installed (that starts squealing on take off after only around 30 miles now (it used to be 80-odd)
I also ordered a holding tool as I'm going to do this myself. I've had the belt cover off recently to have a look and as well as watched a couple of videos on youtube and read the section in the manual that was linked to here...... and the job seems fairly straightforward.
I've got a long handled torque wrench so I think I'm good to go. Other than a good brush out I think OTW suggested cleaning the pulley surfaces thoroughly with some sort of alcohol based cleaner?
I'll take some pics (for Nireen's Downtown archive)
Wish me luck!
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When cleaning pully s and sheeves, use de natured alcohol or Acetone. Regular alcohol is oil based. Anything oily or greasy on belt is a no no.
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Good morning everyone.
So my new Mitsuboshi drive belt and holding tool is here.
Can I ask, is the belt directional (like tyres f'rinstance?)
I can't see any arrows on it, so I'm assuming not....
[Edit] Scrap that!. I've just noticed arrows printed on the topside next to the Mitsuboshie logo(s)....
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Well the old belt is off. That was quite quick - probably due to me doing a recce strip down a couple of months ago meaning the belt cover was easy enough to come off. The holding tool worked well and the retaining nuts came off easily enough with my torque wrench.
There is a filter on the belt cover that seems to be a bit choked up with debris (obviously because it's choked up with debris must mean its doing its job...) I'll give it a clean before reassembly.
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Well it's on and it's tightened itself up ok....oh, and there are no leftover bits (always a good sign)
A damn sight easier (and less messier) than a chain and sprockets, that for sure!
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Well it's on and it's tightened itself up ok....oh, and there are no leftover bits (always a good sign)
A damn sight easier (and less messier) than a chain and sprockets, that for sure!
YOU DID PUT LOCK-TIGHT BLUE ON THE THREADS, JUST A DROP WILL DO IT,
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YOU DID PUT LOCK-TIGHT BLUE ON THE THREADS, JUST A DROP WILL DO IT,
I didn't put any of that in the threads. It didn't mention it in the manual. The bolts are correctly torqued though. Does everyone else use it? There didn't appear to be any there when I stripped it down
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I didn't put any of that in the threads. It didn't mention it in the manual. The bolts are correctly torqued though. She's everyone else use it? There didn't appear to be any there when I sttripped it down
If you torqued according to the manual it will be fine. Blue Loctite ads a bit more security.
Sent from my Redmi 4 using Tapatalk
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Thanks all. I took it for a spin and all seems to be fine - much better in fact. Smoother & quieter for sure.
As my test run took me past the auto parts store, I nipped in and got some Loctite thread lock. It's supposed to be wet tomorrow, so I might take it apart again - I don't think it will take me more than half an hour now and it's good practice for me.
Cheers
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Drive belt stripdown take 2....
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4311/36088752325_811202e472_b.jpg)
..and all because the lady loves Loctite threadlock.
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4307/35698740260_3904e86925_b.jpg)
Cheers!
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....and after a long-ish run this morning.....it still makes a noise from a standing start.
.....AND on closer inspection & going by the faded print, it looks like the belt I took off was a 4000 mile old Mitsuboshi part
So the upshot is that after this weekend I've got sore knees and back and I'm a £140 worse off. In any other world that sounds like a good night out and I kind of wish I'd left the original belt alone and done just that.
Back to the drawing board I guess.
In the meantime, here's a pic of a tired old wreck.......... with the remains of a 12th century castle in the background
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4291/36066084316_916872a905_b.jpg)
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Check your variator, if there is a ridge on it then it is worn out. You have to see it and feel it. Also there is a bearing to check inside the metal transmission cover, it connects to the clutch axle.
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Thanks for that MJ - I did mean to update the board on this one.
It seems to be working fine now (touch wood!) I was out last night and no noise whatsoever on take off (I didn't give it the full beans though)
Maybe it was just settling down? I cleaned the metal surface faces with meths as directed by others and I don't recall feeling anything untoward.
Saying that, my new air filter, spark plug and oli filter has arrived, so next time the weather's a bit rotten, I might just spend a day in the shed with the bike, my radio and a thermos of coffee and check it over again while installing my service parts.
Thanks again!
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in Canada we call it Nufi screech, USA call it white lightning
The one you can buy from manufacturer is Everclear. Sight returns faster than strained Sterno (or Canned Heat...the Band named themselves after this) . We be "Goin' Up The Country"