KymcoForum.com

Scooters - 50cc => Super 8 => Topic started by: gnvernon on June 26, 2014, 04:26:10 PM

Title: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on June 26, 2014, 04:26:10 PM: I purchased my 2012 Super 8 last summer and had it derestricted at the dealership. They said they installed the derestriction parts that come with it and removed the rev limiter. I keep up on all of my maintenace but am only getting 32 MPH on the flats and I weigh 170 pounds. I noticed that if i get it up to 35 going down a hill, then I can easily hold that speed on the flats. Any advice on new roller weights, carb jet, or other easy modifications that will increase my performance? Thank you
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on June 26, 2014, 04:32:50 PM: New carb/pipe/clutch/variator.

You can get all that thru SPI for well under 300.00, and get 50-55MPH.

The next step would be a BBK or Big Bore Kit. That could get you to 60MPH. around 150.00 or less depending on what level BBK you buy.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on June 26, 2014, 04:39:18 PM: any advice on which kind to get?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on June 26, 2014, 05:10:22 PM: gne you have a 4t ?. Just to let you know there is no CDI restriction on the 2t Super 8 (the the CDI restriction wires should not be there stock in a 2t)
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on June 26, 2014, 06:09:45 PM: http://www.spi-parts.com/scooter-parts-performance/kymco/polini-3g-racing-clutch-107mm-3-shoe.html (http://www.spi-parts.com/scooter-parts-performance/kymco/polini-3g-racing-clutch-107mm-3-shoe.html)

http://www.spi-parts.com/scooter-parts-performance/kymco/polini-variator-kymco-people-50.html (http://www.spi-parts.com/scooter-parts-performance/kymco/polini-variator-kymco-people-50.html)

http://www.spi-parts.com/scooter-parts-performance/kymco/malossi-variator-adjuster-srping-honda.html (http://www.spi-parts.com/scooter-parts-performance/kymco/malossi-variator-adjuster-srping-honda.html)

http://www.spi-parts.com/brand/tecnigas/trek-kymco-super-9-top-boy.html (http://www.spi-parts.com/brand/tecnigas/trek-kymco-super-9-top-boy.html)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/new-replacement-OEM-from-Dellorto-PHBG-DS-Black-21mm-Racing-Carburetor-Carb-/221247114740?pt=Other_Vehicle_Parts&hash=item33835b0df4 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/new-replacement-OEM-from-Dellorto-PHBG-DS-Black-21mm-Racing-Carburetor-Carb-/221247114740?pt=Other_Vehicle_Parts&hash=item33835b0df4)

Forum members have an arrangement with SPI. Call up, and set up a dealer account. (everyone can do this)
That way your web page will show the Dealer cost for the items. It's between 20 - 40% off most items.

Perhaps he can even supply the Carb for you at a good price.

http://www.kymcoforum.com/index.php?topic=11581.0 (http://www.kymcoforum.com/index.php?topic=11581.0)
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on June 26, 2014, 06:30:46 PM: does anyone know the dimensions for the main jet in the keihin 16 mm carb?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on June 26, 2014, 07:03:15 PM: 78 / 82 is the norm. 27 / 34 for pilots. Depending on altitude.

You can up jet them some... 16mm is just too small to make power w/ a pipe. 19-20mm is perfect w/ an 8K pipe.
The Polini clutch is fully tunable to launch at 7K if you like but it ia also tamable to launch at 3K if you prefer a lower profile.

If you trim up a Malossi sport you can easily gain 5HP with a carb/pipe.
I think B&W has some "old type" (olden timey.) manifolds that might work...
If your handy w/ a grinder you can modify the stock manifold to 19-20mm, and work as a universal coupler.

It'll be reliable, and strong. Mine lasted 3 years of daily beatings. The kymco cases are plenty strong. The only failures are when raw parts are hammered together by overanxious "builders".
We've all done it.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on June 30, 2014, 06:11:39 PM: What type of variator rollers would you recommend and how to I know what weight to get?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: BettinANDlosing on June 30, 2014, 06:21:03 PM: Yeah I think you're shop bullsh**ted you a little bit. There is no rev limit on the new 2t bikes. Maybe they didn't put the derestrcted main jet in.... I've found the s8 fully de restricted should get a solid 35mph. Look into my exhaust derestrction thread, that'll get you a solid 40. The best variator is made by Dr. Pulley, and pair that with Dr. Pulley sliders and a yellow or red torque spring.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 01, 2014, 04:10:34 PM: what weight sliders do you recommend? I plan on performing the exhaust mod, opening the airbox intake, and I have an 85 and 90 jet at my disposal.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 01, 2014, 04:12:19 PM: Quote from: gnvernon on July 01, 2014, 03:53:21 PM
I also went to do some carb tuning the other day and noticed my air screw isnt actually a screw.... its flat. Is this normal?

Its normal.

Options are:

Buy a proper special socket for the screws head as it stands with a flat on it.

Dremel a slot while on the carb.

Dremel a slot after taking screw out by turning it with needle nose pliers.

Just be careful as I almost trashed mine by holding both the dremel and pin by hand. Its very soft brass and I mean soft.

A hacksaw blade can also be used.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 01, 2014, 04:58:33 PM: Any thoughts on this variator? http://www.scooterdynasty.com/PoliniHighPerformanceSpeedControlVariatorKitsforKymcoScooters.aspx (http://www.scooterdynasty.com/PoliniHighPerformanceSpeedControlVariatorKitsforKymcoScooters.aspx)
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 01, 2014, 05:06:11 PM: I see they did derestrict your scooter at 32MPH the smooth boss is probably on. Did they put on the #82 jet and did you take the tube out of the airbox if the #82 jet is actually on.

I think an initial exhaust mod and an upjet to at least a #85 jet would be my first choice but others depending on tool availability my think otherwise.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 01, 2014, 05:14:20 PM: I tried taking the snorkel out of the airbox and dremeled out the opening. This caused me to have fine takeoffs but would nearly die after 10 MPH
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: nuggzy on July 04, 2014, 03:10:30 AM: first I did full NCY cvt kit,and 82 main jet better performance but still lil sluggish then added OML high output coil wire and iradium plug smoother idle and starting , and today I added a hand made leo vince T.T. exhaust and rollers that came with it not sure on the grams and changed spring to 1000rpm and 1500 clutch springs after an hr tweaking the carb I think I got the sweet spot because it really woke up and has awesome acceleration great low end I was bypassing the 45mph mark but backed off it would of went more I still hade some throttle left but I wanted to check the plug to see were im standing before I run it to hard thinking of jetting up to 85 main after looking at the plug im scared of running to lean .
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on July 06, 2014, 05:59:01 AM: Quote from: gnvernon on July 01, 2014, 04:58:33 PM
Any thoughts on this variator? http://www.scooterdynasty.com/PoliniHighPerformanceSpeedControlVariatorKitsforKymcoScooters.aspx (http://www.scooterdynasty.com/PoliniHighPerformanceSpeedControlVariatorKitsforKymcoScooters.aspx)

That's a very good variator. Order it from SPI, and it will be 30-40 bucks cheaper. http://www.kymcoforum.com/index.php?topic=11581.0 (http://www.kymcoforum.com/index.php?topic=11581.0)
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: BettinANDlosing on July 06, 2014, 04:04:36 PM: I just got the polini hi speed, I had to customize the noon moveable drive face to get the pulley to go all the way together. Other than that I love it, high revs right off the line and settles into nice cruising rpm. Get rollers with it because mine came with stupid light weights, like 4.9 & 3.5. Don't expect much gain with a variator alone tho, you'll be disappointed.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 08, 2014, 02:16:54 PM: UPDATE: I am still waiting on my jets and then have to find time to install them. However, I got +4 MPH simply by optimizing my tire pressure.

I am going to get a new contra spring and new roller weights. I need a new spring regardless because by hill climbing is sub-par but would putting new weights in a stock var be worth it? and if so, what weights sould I get?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 08, 2014, 02:31:21 PM: Quote from: gnvernon on July 08, 2014, 02:16:54 PM
UPDATE: I am still waiting on my jets and then have to find time to install them. However, I got +4 MPH simply by optimizing my tire pressure.

I am going to get a new contra spring and new roller weights. I need a new spring regardless because by hill climbing is sub-par but would putting new weights in a stock var be worth it? and if so, what weights sould I get?

When you say optimize did you over inflate the tires or just made sure they were the correct tire pressure ?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 08, 2014, 03:06:17 PM: front: 30 PSI
Rear: 31 PSI
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 08, 2014, 03:20:06 PM: I must check into to that. Do you have a good tire gage to get accurate pressure reading ?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 08, 2014, 03:35:35 PM: $10 digital pressure guage from walmart. seems to be pretty accurate when tested against my Acura TL's TPMS pressures. Did have a tough time getting a good reading from the rear tire though. Not exactly sure why.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: BettinANDlosing on July 08, 2014, 03:40:25 PM: Dang that's still low, go 40 in the rear and 35 front to gain even more speed. Also yes sliders will help with stock, but you'll want to get 7-8 g especially if you plan to get a stiff contrast spring. Stiffer spring = heavier weights to pull through that spring.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 08, 2014, 03:42:31 PM: max PSI on the tires says 32 PSI.... If I am going to get sliders will I want to get 8-9 g then? I've heard that the sliders act about a gram lighter than rollers. Yellow spring?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: BettinANDlosing on July 08, 2014, 03:45:57 PM: Red spring week rip up hill but most likely over rev past your power band. Those tires could handle 100psi before blowing, I run 40psi on my zuma and it increases to speed quite a bit. Yeah I would try 8g, 9 would be to much.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 08, 2014, 03:47:48 PM: soooooo yellow spring? I could go for a stiffer spring right now just because when I approach a hill my revs are waaaayyyyy too low. Hopefully 8g sliders and a yellow spring will be a good mix with what I have.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 08, 2014, 03:54:59 PM: Not to hijack but stay on subject, what would the a guess on the ideal rollers be with a yellow contra spring change ?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 08, 2014, 04:04:20 PM: ^^^I had the same question. Bettin what PSI do you run on your kymco?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 08, 2014, 04:16:08 PM: I am reading that people blow their belts if using too high of a PSI Contra Spring. So what is the stock spring in PSI ?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 08, 2014, 05:04:00 PM: I would have to guess around 1000. Does anyone know what dimensions the stock rollers are?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: BettinANDlosing on July 09, 2014, 01:58:02 AM: Stock rollers are 16x13, I run 35 / 30 psi on the bet and win. 40/ 35. With my zuma. With contrast springs, you only want to go as tight as needed, any tighter and you will decrease belt life and actually top speed too
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on July 09, 2014, 03:45:34 AM: This thread is driving me f'n nutz...

The yellow spring is weaker than the OEM spring in a 4t OEM clutch. Get a Purple Malossi (1500) or a red Malossi (2000)
If you are around 150LBS then the purple, and 7gr Dr. Pulleys. If you are closer to 200LBS go red, and 7-8 gr Dr. Pulleys.

Belt wear is subjective... Depends on how you ride. Tighter cvt parts do wear the belt faster but I generally get 2-3 belts a year. I ride20-30 miles a day/everyday so you can do the math.

I am also a HUGE fan of maximum tire pressure labels. B&L is correct that the tire can hold A LOT more than the Max. label but I can drink A LOT more than a liter of Whiskey. Neither of these are good IMHO>

All better now. Love you guys!
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 09, 2014, 03:57:31 AM: Quote from: zombie on July 09, 2014, 03:45:34 AM
This thread is driving me f'n nutz...

The yellow spring is weaker than the OEM spring in a 4t OEM clutch.

But I dont think either of us has the 4t. We are senior citizens, WE ARE ALL CONFUSED!!!!!!!

I would like to try a stiffer contra spring but dont know which one to get, and if I do try a stiffer contra spring for hill climbing, do I need to get heavier rollers to counteract the additional spring stiffness as I dont know what weight rollers I have presently on the stock variator.

I weigh 160 lbs pre beer guzzling.

2013 super 8 50 cc 2t 800 miles on OD
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on July 09, 2014, 04:21:42 AM: Rush Hour - Do You Speak English!!!??? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oA95AkZRVKE#)

Get the Phrlsiwnd or the Rsl IF YOU weigh 834- 917krz.

Use Ht. Pisjeec 0ed OR Ge. Jqllxb 1jf
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: BettinANDlosing on July 09, 2014, 07:19:57 AM: Get both, cheap enough and you'll use both sooner or later. A stiffer spring with the same weights as a soft spring will rev higher, and with no other real mods will rev too high really fast. Your peak power stock is 7-8000rpm. Red spring with stock 8.5g will be revving to 8k rpm almost always right over your power band. Parts like exhaust and 70cc will enjoy revving higher.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 09, 2014, 01:11:38 PM: Quote from: BettinANDlosing on July 09, 2014, 07:19:57 AM
Get both, cheap enough and you'll use both sooner or later. A stiffer spring with the same weights as a soft spring will rev higher, and with no other real mods will rev too high really fast. Your peak power stock is 7-8000rpm. Red spring with stock 8.5g will be revving to 8k rpm almost always right over your power band. Parts like exhaust and 70cc will enjoy revving higher.

Let me ask,

Is it for certain that the yellow 1500 spring is same or less than what is on there stock now for 2013 S8 50CC 2T ?

Throwing a dart, what would be a good initial gram weight and spring compression value to try with my setup as is? Goal to get a little better uphill performance.

I am considering 9 gm weights and a White Spring as my first guess as thats what one of the Malossi Kits has for the S8. My thought is they wouldnt provide a weaker spring than stock but if its for racing I'M GUESSING THEY COULD.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on July 09, 2014, 06:41:40 PM: Quote from: Chris0381 on July 09, 2014, 01:11:38 PM
Let me ask,

Is it for certain that the yellow 1500 spring is same or less than what is on there stock now for 2013 S8 50CC 2T ?

Throwing a dart, what would be a good initial gram weight and spring compression value to try with my setup as is? Goal to get a little better uphill performance.

I am considering 9 gm weights and a White Spring as my first guess as thats what one of the Malossi Kits has for the S8. My thought is they wouldnt provide a weaker spring than stock but if its for racing I'M GUESSING THEY COULD.

I don't have any idea how many times this has been said....

Malossi red, and 7-8gr Dr. pulley if you are 200lbs
Malossi Purple, and Dr. pulley 7-8 if you are closer to 150lbs

I have a shop FULL of springs/sliders/rollers. Perhaps 250-300 of them. Different makes/rates, and weights.

The above two combinations are the best for every brand scooter or engine type in 50cc to 100cc BBK's.

Spanish:
No tengo idea de cuÃ¡ntas veces esto se ha dicho ....

Rojo Malossi y 7-8gr Dr. polea si usted es 200 libras
Malossi pÃºrpura, y el Dr. polea 7-8 si estÃ¡ mÃ¡s cerca de Â£ 150

Tengo una tienda llena de resortes / deslizadores / rodillos. Tal vez 250-300 de ellos. Diferentes marcas / tipos y pesos.

Las dos combinaciones anteriores son los mejores para cada scooter de marca o tipo de motor de 50cc a 100cc de BBK.

Gaelic:
NÃ dÃ³igh liom go bhfuil aon smaoineamh cÃ© mhÃ©ad uair tÃ¡ sÃ© seo rÃ¡ite ....

Malossi dearg, agus 7-8gr Dr ulÃ³ige mÃ¡ tÃ¡ tÃº Â£ 200
Malossi Corcra, agus an Dr ulÃ³ige 7-8 mÃ¡ tÃ¡ tÃº nÃos gaire do Â£ 150

TÃ¡ mÃ© siopa IOMLÃN Springs / BarraÃ SleamhnÃ¡in / rollÃ³irÃ. B'fhÃ©idir 250-300 acu. DhÃ©anann Ã©agsÃºla / rÃ¡taÃ, agus meÃ¡chain.

Is iad an dÃ¡ thuas teaglamaÃ is fearr do gach scÃºtar branda nÃ³ cineÃ¡l-inneall 50cc go 100cc i BBK ar.

German:
ch habe keine Ahnung, wie oft dies gesagt wurde ....

Malossi rot, und 7-8gr Dr. Riemenscheibe, wenn Sie 200 Â£ sind
Malossi Lila, und Dr. Scheibe 7-8, wenn Sie nÃ¤her an 150 Â£ sind

Ich habe einen Laden voller Federn / Gleiter / Rollen. Vielleicht 250-300 von ihnen. Verschiedene Marken / Raten und Gewichten.

Die beiden oben genannten Kombinationen sind die besten fÃ¼r jede Marke Roller oder Motortyp in 50cc bis 100cc BBK.

Italian:
Non ho alcuna idea di quante volte questo Ã¨ stato detto ....

Malossi rosso, e 7-8gr Dr. puleggia se siete Â£ 200
Malossi Viola, e il dottor puleggia 7-8 se sei piÃ¹ vicino a 150 Â£

Ho un negozio pieno di molle / cursori / rulli. Forse 250-300 di loro. Diverse marche / tariffe, e pesi.

I suddetti due combinazioni sono i migliori per ogni scooter marca o tipo di motore a 50cc a 100cc BBK di.

Czeck:
NemÃ¡m ponÄ›tÃ, kolikrÃ¡t to bylo Å™eÄeno ....

Malossi ÄervenÃ½, a 7-8gr Dr. kladka, pokud jste 200 liber
Malossi Purple, a Dr. kladka 7-8, pokud jste blÃÅ¾e k 150 liber

MÃ¡m obchod plnÃ½ Springs / slidery / vÃ¡leÄky. MoÅ¾nÃ¡, Å¾e 250-300 z nich. RÅ¯znÃ½ch znaÄek / ceny a vÃ¡hy.

Oba vÃ½Å¡e uvedenÃ© kombinace jsou nejlepÅ¡Ã pro vÅ¡echny znaÄky skÃºtr nebo typu motoru od 50 ccm do 100 ccm v BBK

Thai:
à¸œà¸¡à¹„à¸¡à¹ˆà¹„à¸”à¹‰à¸¡à¸µà¸„à¸§à¸²à¸¡à¸„à¸´à¸”à¸à¸µà¹ˆà¸„à¸£à¸±à¹‰à¸‡à¸™à¸µà¹‰à¹„à¸”à¹‰à¸£à¸±à¸šà¸à¸²à¸£à¸à¸¥à¹ˆà¸²à¸§à¸§à¹ˆà¸² ....

Malossi à¸ªà¸µà¹à¸”à¸‡à¹à¸¥à¸° 7-8gr à¸”à¸£. à¸¥à¸¹à¸à¸£à¸à¸à¸–à¹‰à¸²à¸„à¸¸à¸“à¹€à¸›à¹‡à¸™Â£ 200
Malossi à¸ªà¸µà¸¡à¹ˆà¸§à¸‡à¹à¸¥à¸° à¸”à¸£. à¸¥à¸¹à¸à¸£à¸à¸ 7-8 à¸–à¹‰à¸²à¸„à¸¸à¸“à¸¡à¸µà¸„à¸§à¸²à¸¡à¹ƒà¸à¸¥à¹‰à¸Šà¸´à¸”à¸à¸±à¸šÂ£ 150

à¸‰à¸±à¸™à¸¡à¸µà¸£à¹‰à¸²à¸™à¹€à¸•à¹‡à¸¡à¸ˆà¸³à¸™à¸§à¸™à¸‚à¸à¸‡à¸ªà¸›à¸£à¸´à¸‡ / à¹€à¸¥à¸·à¹ˆà¸à¸™ / à¸¥à¸¹à¸à¸à¸¥à¸´à¹‰à¸‡ à¸šà¸²à¸‡à¸—à¸µ 250-300 à¸‚à¸à¸‡à¸žà¸§à¸à¹€à¸‚à¸² à¸—à¸³à¹ƒà¸«à¹‰à¹à¸•à¸à¸•à¹ˆà¸²à¸‡à¸à¸±à¸™ / à¸à¸±à¸•à¸£à¸²à¹à¸¥à¸°à¸™à¹‰à¸³à¸«à¸™à¸±à¸

à¸‚à¹‰à¸²à¸‡à¸•à¹‰à¸™à¸—à¸±à¹‰à¸‡à¸ªà¸à¸‡à¸Šà¸¸à¸”à¸—à¸µà¹ˆà¸”à¸µà¸—à¸µà¹ˆà¸ªà¸¸à¸”à¸ªà¸³à¸«à¸£à¸±à¸šà¸—à¸¸à¸à¸ªà¸à¸¹à¸•à¹€à¸•à¸à¸£à¹Œà¸¢à¸µà¹ˆà¸«à¹‰à¸à¸«à¸£à¸·à¸à¸Šà¸™à¸´à¸”à¸‚à¸à¸‡à¹€à¸„à¸£à¸·à¹ˆà¸à¸‡à¸¢à¸™à¸•à¹Œà¹ƒà¸™ 50cc à¹€à¸žà¸·à¹ˆà¸ 100cc BBK à¸‚à¸à¸‡

Jibberish:
jdewjuj ji4jk f s eiuisre siifjjsxkjkje ozooe
keke rjfd sori wsoiw8irjgf sooreor d sdoosr998
H s d kiioeloe riiiiao zjckjio99rif cdkdkoikkdkdllgkj dditg d diutipoopsd sdiuiudo9809sa[p nhsozo
sdjjk fiodktrki vhjBBK

Get whatever you want, and let us know how it works out. We are all here to learn.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 10, 2014, 11:55:24 AM: Quote from: BettinANDlosing on July 08, 2014, 03:40:25 PM
Dang that's still low, go 40 in the rear and 35 front to gain even more speed. Also yes sliders will help with stock, but you'll want to get 7-8 g especially if you plan to get a stiff contrast spring. Stiffer spring = heavier weights to pull through that spring.

I got about a 1 MPH gain from this last night. How ever so slight addition to top speed, it also decrease the rolling resistance and seemed to make the transition from a flat to a hill smoother with less initial loss of speed. I have a lot of hills where I live and this little performance increase helps a bit.

Just ordered a Joes Racing Tire Gage for $24 off ebay. http://toolguyd.com/joes-racing-tire-pressure-gauge-review/ (http://toolguyd.com/joes-racing-tire-pressure-gauge-review/) About time I repalaced my 30 year old one.

Still waiting on the #86 jet to arrive and presently running 3/4 turns out on the air screw, real nice ride last night.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 10, 2014, 01:53:19 PM: Zombie I have seen everywhere online that the YELLOW spring is 1500 and that red is indeed 2000. I also dont want to rev over my power band.

Also, Chris I believe the white is even softer than stock. If you did that and increased your roller weight I dont think you would even make it up a hill lol.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 10, 2014, 02:44:06 PM: Quote from: gnvernon on July 10, 2014, 01:53:19 PM
Zombie I have seen everywhere online that the YELLOW spring is 1500 and that red is indeed 2000. I also dont want to rev over my power band.

Also, Chris I believe the white is even softer than stock. If you did that and increased your roller weight I dont think you would even make it up a hill lol.

What is confusing me is that you read that if you increase your contra spring compression value, your supposed to be increasing your roller weights. So is going to a Malossi Purple a smaller compression value or greater value? as new Dr Pulley 8 gm rollers are less weight than the stock 8.5 gm rollers.?

My assumption then would be that the 8.5 stock rollers are a bit heavy for this bike to begin with and could be restricting it a touch or the purple spring hasa lessor compression value that the stock spring since lighter rollers are recommended.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: BettinANDlosing on July 10, 2014, 03:11:58 PM: I think your over thinking it. You have to try one and see how you like it.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 10, 2014, 03:17:42 PM: Quote from: BettinANDlosing on July 10, 2014, 03:11:58 PM
I think your over thinking it. You have to try one and see how you like it.

Yea I agree. I'll throw on a spring and see how its performance is then go form there and then exchange rollers around the spring. The purple is a bit hard to find here in the states as its mainly on Ebay in the UK etc.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: BettinANDlosing on July 10, 2014, 03:20:31 PM: Exactly, just don't go with the super tight during right away, start with medium. I'd you order your weights heavy maybe get 9g then use a scale and dremell to lighten them perfectly. Just evenly grind off brass from the inside.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 10, 2014, 03:31:18 PM: Quote from: BettinANDlosing on July 10, 2014, 03:20:31 PM
Exactly, just don't go with the super tight during right away, start with medium. I'd you order your weights heavy maybe get 9g then use a scale and dremell to lighten them perfectly. Just evenly grind off brass from the inside.

Thanks Bettin, I'l lgo that route. I dont expect the change to be drastic.

Maybe Zombie can hook me up with a scale :)
;)
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 10, 2014, 04:00:21 PM: any headshop will have a scale for $5 or less. They are also super cheap on amazon
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: BettinANDlosing on July 10, 2014, 04:24:25 PM: Quote from: gnvernon on July 10, 2014, 04:00:21 PM
any headshop will have a scale for $5 or less. They are also super cheap on amazon
Plus you can bundle and get yourself nice new bong.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on July 10, 2014, 06:51:11 PM: Quote from: Chris0381 on July 10, 2014, 03:31:18 PM
Thanks Bettin, I'l lgo that route. I dont expect the change to be drastic.

Maybe Zombie can hook me up with a scale :)
;)

I don't weigh my sh**. If it fills the shed the order was correct.

Here is the spring stuff... http://www.racingplanetusa.com/variator-torque-spring-malossi-different-categories-p-2334-1.html?cPath=2_622_26516&sessID=3496a2decbe49f463aa23bcd8c1b6e78#.U77d2m3bzl8 (http://www.racingplanetusa.com/variator-torque-spring-malossi-different-categories-p-2334-1.html?cPath=2_622_26516&sessID=3496a2decbe49f463aa23bcd8c1b6e78#.U77d2m3bzl8)

If you stay w/ OEM roller weights swapping the spring will do nothing or never allow the bike to change gear ratios.
Stiffer springs require heavier rollers. Like I said. Use whatever you want to, and post up your results so we can all say "Told ya" or get one of the two combinations posted thousands of times, and say "Thanks for helping me improve my bike"

If you want to do some science crap research then by all means do it. I have done all the testing of combo's that can be done on these dumb ass 50-100cc scooters. BUT I used all the print outs to roll up a super hooter, and have since lost touch w/ reality. I think one of you has already beaten me there...
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 11, 2014, 01:50:26 AM: Quote from: zombie on July 10, 2014, 06:51:11 PM

Stiffer springs require heavier rollers.

Thats what Im trying to figure out. The purple spring you suggest is stiffer than OEM and the stock rollers are 8.5 gram then why would the 7.0 gram rollers be ideal with that stiffer purple spring for someone weighing near 150 lbs? I guess it must be a case of "it is what it is then".
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: BettinANDlosing on July 11, 2014, 01:57:42 AM: You could take out your spring and paint it red then put in 12g square weights, be hittin 100 no prob.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 11, 2014, 02:04:52 AM: Quote from: BettinANDlosing on July 11, 2014, 01:57:42 AM
You could take out your spring and paint it red then put in 12g square weights, be hittin 100 no prob.

And thats why I should probably be putting this modding for more performance to rest and just be happy with what I presently have. The scooter is doing what I purchased it for (alternative transport to work should my car break down plus a little bit more.)
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on July 11, 2014, 09:27:50 PM: The 8.5 gram OEM rollers are too heavy for the purple spring. You will not get the full benefit because the rollers will open the rear pulleys faster than you want. The idea of a stiffer spring is to force the belt to stay at a lower ratio longer, and you have to keep in mind Dr. Pulley act lighter than they are so a 7gr DP is equal to a 6gr OEM
Lower ratio = better hill climbing. As you approach the hill the rpms drop. As the rpms drop the rollers retreat. As the rollers retreat the spring pulls the belt to a lower ratio. As the ratio is lowered the torque to the rear wheel is amplified. As the torque is amplified the bike climbs better. As the bike climbs better your smile gets bigger. As your smile gets bigger you look more like a retard driving a scooter, and smiling for no damn good reason. Then you realize I made you retarded.

Hope that helps
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 11, 2014, 09:56:55 PM: Quote from: zombie on July 11, 2014, 09:27:50 PM

Hope that helps

That does help and I'll go with your config.

Thanks Zombie
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on July 11, 2014, 10:02:07 PM: Love ya Bro! Thanks.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 11, 2014, 10:14:41 PM: And same here Zombie, just grabbed the jet set off ebay, will get the spring and rollers next. Time for cold beer now.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on July 12, 2014, 05:22:12 AM: It's the best part of the day... Once the dust settles, and you can kick back w/ a cold one. For me that is usually around 7:30-8:00 am. I miss the crack tho...
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 15, 2014, 02:21:56 PM: chris will you post your results once you get them?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 15, 2014, 02:33:52 PM: Quote from: gnvernon on July 15, 2014, 02:21:56 PM
chris will you post your results once you get them?

Sure will, all parts should be in by Friday. Just looking for a variator locking tool for the 2 stoke, they a are all in Europe. Just ordered a bell housing holder from Ebay.

This is something to keep in mind:

I always use an impact gun to tighten my variator nut, and have never had a problem...

infact I also use the same nut time and time again, the main issue which no one has mentioned in this topic: is making sure the belt is pushed down the front pulley before tightening the nut (whichever method you use to tighten)...

if the belt isnt pushed down the pulley, you will simply trap the belt between the 2 pulley halves, all will seem tight and fine until you move off, the belt moves and the nut come loose.

you would be surprised how many people who havent worked it out yet...
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 15, 2014, 04:34:03 PM: ia the variator locking tool neccessary?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on July 15, 2014, 05:01:15 PM: No. They sell a lot of them tho.

Chris is spot on about the belt. I let the var turn a little while tightening it all up. It sucks when the var blows apart.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 16, 2014, 12:22:00 AM: I also need to credit the Honda Ruckus forum for that tip. Forgot to credit the OP or get his name.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 16, 2014, 12:39:08 AM: Quote from: gnvernon on July 15, 2014, 04:34:03 PM
ia the variator locking tool neccessary?

Not always, you can use an impact wrench, but it would be nice to have something under your seat to be able to do a belt repair out in the boonies. But for someone who doesn't have the feel for an impact wrench, a holding tool with a torque wrench and a drop of loctite gives some POM that you've done the job right.

I have a feeling the clutch nut is factory sealed with gobs of loctite and torqued on quite hard. Not sure about the variator as the shop I bought the bike from may have repalced the boss with a smooth boss and loosened the nut up for me or overtorqued it with an impact wrench.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on July 16, 2014, 02:13:21 AM: I've never encountered LokTite on a factory installed CVT part. They are all single use "Captive Nuts", and designed to self lok.
Either purchase a pocket full of them or use a drop of Blue Lok-Tite. I have had a few Var nuts spin off if I didn't use either one or the other. The clutch bell is more secure due to the larger surface area of the splines.
Var pulley 1/2's can strip the small spline area, and spin off under De-accell
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 16, 2014, 02:05:13 PM: any chance you could post a video of you removing your var/clutch?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 16, 2014, 02:28:05 PM: Quote from: gnvernon on July 16, 2014, 02:05:13 PM
any chance you could post a video of you removing your var/clutch?

All the parts are in, I just dont have the right tools yet. I may be able to do a video, we'll see. It may be 2-3 weeks before I get the variator tool. After all this acing Planet still hasn't shipped the jets I ordered 2+ weeks ago and the jets from Ebay just came after 3 days.

I may be able to rejet #87 today and install a power adapter for USB ports once the storms pass thru.

I don't have to replace the V-notches with new sliders do I ?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on July 16, 2014, 04:00:06 PM: I thought the variator tool wasnt necessary?
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 16, 2014, 04:10:00 PM: Quote from: gnvernon on July 16, 2014, 04:00:06 PM
I thought the variator tool wasnt necessary?

I dont have an impact wrench.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on July 16, 2014, 05:23:33 PM: how to change your variator and clutch (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nQ5h6_01oys#ws)

You don't always have to replace the little "V" slides. Just make sure they are not worn thru. I order those by the dozen from parts for scooters. They are kind of everywhere around my shop/house.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: BettinANDlosing on July 16, 2014, 08:27:52 PM: I've also found a crude but effective way of removing the Big clutch nut is using a flathead screwdriver and you can pound in counter clockwise. Usually I have a vice handle and just vice w/ adjustable pliers works great.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on July 16, 2014, 10:17:58 PM: I bought the big socket for the 1/2" impact. It takes about ten minutes to swap rollers, and the contra spring.
There a a hundred ways to skin that cat.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: BettinANDlosing on July 17, 2014, 02:00:04 AM: Yeah I need to get me one of those big ole sockets.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on July 17, 2014, 03:42:46 AM: EbayI bought a big Matco 4 socket set for 27.00. The largest of the set is the one that fit. 27mm i THINK.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 17, 2014, 01:15:21 PM: Ill probably got to HF and get a 15" Pittsburgh Steel adjustable and give this a try.

EASY Scooter Clutch Nut Removal (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aEDdglsl9PM#ws)
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on July 31, 2014, 01:33:37 PM: Quote from: zombie on July 11, 2014, 09:27:50 PM
As the torque is amplified the bike climbs better. As the bike climbs better your smile gets bigger. As your smile gets bigger you look more like a retard driving a scooter, and smiling for no damn good reason. Then you realize I made you retarded.

Hope that helps

https://www.dropbox.com/s/cwgafnjik3lpkek/pudding-face.jpg (https://www.dropbox.com/s/cwgafnjik3lpkek/pudding-face.jpg)
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: gnvernon on August 20, 2014, 04:06:35 PM: Tomorrow I will be posting pictures and instructions of rejetting, exhaust mod, contra spring change, DP slider change in the "technical how to" section of the forum for those who have no clue how to do these.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Chris0381 on August 20, 2014, 11:00:26 PM: Not sure what I did but I picked up 2 MPH today. Im about 42 now on the flats, I down jetted from 86 to 85 and opened the airscrew 1/2 turn. Was doing 40 MPH up slight upgrade.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on December 15, 2014, 07:49:37 AM: Wrong forum Thomashoma. These are scooters.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: BettinANDlosing on December 15, 2014, 01:46:35 PM: Quote from: Thomashoma on December 15, 2014, 06:22:12 AM
Hi guys im considering putting a turbokit under the hood of my rx8..

Just struggling to find details on exactley the performance increase i would be expected to get, 0-100?

Also any specs on recommended kits would be great.

Cheers

Lol
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: Triesandluth on December 27, 2014, 04:29:16 AM: Quote from: zombie on July 11, 2014, 09:27:50 PM
As the bike climbs better your smile gets bigger. As your smile gets bigger you look more like a retard driving a scooter, and smiling for no damn good reason. Then you realize I made you retarded.

Hope that helps

I seriously thought about if people could see my face after messing around with my cvt and getting positive results on that first good hill, and how retarded they would think I am.
Then I thought about if people could hear me chuckling to myself about that quote, and b&l's post of square rollers and red paint, and how retarded I really am...
Good reads, guys, good reads... Mostly informative, always entertaining.
Title: Re: Increasing performance on 2012 super 8
Post by: zombie on December 27, 2014, 05:19:07 AM: Appreciate the laugh Tries...

Stick around for the evening show.

Don't forget to tip your waitress. ;)