KymcoForum.com
Scooters - 50cc => Agility 50 => Topic started by: TuttoCambia on August 15, 2009, 04:23:04 AM
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for agility 50...
I was wondering if anyone knows..what do you need in order to install a 70cc or 85cc kit. can you just install it and run stock on everything else or do you need a larger carb and stuff.
basically..what are the exact parts I need to install a 70cc kit or possibly a 85cc.
im looking to order one and I wanna order everything I need to install it all at once.
thanks
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Funny you ask, I'm about to install my 85cc kit today as long as it arrives in the mail. I do have one suggestion, if your going to get any kit don't order it from scootertronics.com they have been horrible for me as far as shipping service and quality. Three weeks after I received the kit and went to put it on the piston rings didn't fit. So now after getting the kit for the second time and 6 weeks I'll be able to answer your question. But all they sent me was the cylinder, new head, #95 jet, Uni air filter and gaskets and stuff. I was also told two different things by different people about exhaust some said you need performance exhaust with 85cc kit some said not, anyhow I'm running ncy exhaust just to be on the safe side. Sorry to ramble on but to answer your question I will post sometime this evening to let you know for sure.
Ken
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While I have no experience with doing this to a KYMCO I will offer a piece of advice. If you use your scooter as daily transportation, "Don't do it!" I have yet to see one of these "kits" that are plug-and-play. Other drawbacks include a serious reduction in gas mileage and reliability. Advice is like wine. It effects you only if taken. ;)
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While I have no experience with doing this to a KYMCO I will offer a piece of advice. If you use your scooter as daily transportation, "Don't do it!" I have yet to see one of these "kits" that are plug-and-play. Other drawbacks include a serious reduction in gas mileage and reliability. Advice is like wine. It effects you only if taken. ;)
...well spoken...
..and if you're riding ur 49cc in a state that requires registering anything above 49...well there's that to think about...
..aaannd if you are riding ur 49cc because of a DWI, and ur still on probation, there's that State Trooper coming around the next curve to think about...
..i dunno...I've got my machine to the point that it runs 50+ mph downhill, and I maintain 42 or above for 90% of the remainder of the time, and I'm happy with that...for now...
..when I'm ready for more speed, I'm going to buy a bigger scooter...
peace
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They truly are plug, and play, and play, and play...! If you like to tune, and fiddle w/ your scoot. more than ride it, aftermarket is the way to go! As for the DOC-FTP! The best advice I can give on mod'in is use all the same manufacture parts. Mixing, and matching only opens doors to fitment, and tuning problems! There are complete kits from all the top dogs, and they have been tuned, and tried before being put on the market. A shop like JIANGWAYNE or MOPED HOSPITAL have the experience to recommend either "full" kits or "stages". Of course you will pay more from them than the guy in a band who owns a scooter shop on the side, but I would listen to the guys who love scoot mods first
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So I just installed the 70cc kit and I ordered the wrong size carb so im goin to try and run my stock carb..anyone have a suggestion..jet size..etc.?
everything is stock on my scooter. I have a #82 jet in the stock carb right now.
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I'm running #95 jet in my 85cc kit so maybe #85 or something like that.
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do you think it will hurt running a #82? its usually about 80 - 90 degrees everyday where I live.
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I dont know the answer to that question to be honest but I would run at least a #85 if it were me. You can call the guys at scooter therapy they are really good there they will probly have some better advice for you.
Ken
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listen to the post before mine. make the call. I have a #95 jet in a delorto carb on a 70cc malossi kit and still managed to burn a piston. another $50. shot
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I have a #90 in there right now cause I saw thats what they recommend on the kit they sell at scootertronics(http://scootertronics.com/fost80up13.html (http://scootertronics.com/fost80up13.html)).
I cant seem to get the scooter started though.
I changed the spark plug..tested the new one before I put it in and it worked..then I pulled it out again to check it and I wasnt seeing any spark(this was all using the kick start cause the battery doesnt last long for starting).
im gonna charge the battery and try again with the elect. start tomorrow.
thanks for all your help guys..im somewhat new to this and its getting a little frustrating for me.
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Keep it simple. With all that work you may have just left a wire disconnected, forgot a ground, or just knocked something loose! KEEP ON SCOOT"IN!!!
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ok I got the engine running..butttt when I drove it today the power was cutting out for spit seconds as I would throttle up..so I down jetted from 90 to 85 and the cutting out went away almost completely. It still does it sometimes so i was thinking of maybe down jetting to 83 or 82 but im afraid of running the engine too lean.
my other idea would be to add a high flow air filter with the 85 jet installed.
any suggestions?
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Where does the cut out occur. Ie idle-just off idle- 1/2 throttle-3/4 throttle- full throttle. just off idle could be the mix adjust, 1/2-3/4 could be the needle hight,and full could be the main jet. try to narrow it down. I just melted a piston by tweaking too far. It only takes a few dozen revolutions.
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I wrapped some masking tape around the throttle grip and marked off lines at idle and full throttle, then divided those into fourths so I could get a good idea of where I was at for tuning purposes. This also helps when doing plug chops at those various positions. Those multi-stage carbs can be a real pain to get tuned! I still don't have mine quite right, but for now it is livable till I find some more time and motivation to keep tweeking! Always try to err on the side of rich and NOT lean!
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It happens at about half throttle..its not that bad during the day but at night when its colder it happens more often and again thats with a 85 main jet.
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Does the "cut out" stop if you throttle past that point? You may want to try lowering the needle and do a plug chop. If it runs ok at full throttle the jet is probably right. If you can't get past the 1/2 throttle cut out, then you probably need to address the size of the main jet.
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What is plug chopping?
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You put in a brand new spark plug and fun the bike at only the throttle position you want to check. Then you kill the engine while still holding this throttle position until it fully dies. Then you pull the plug and examine it. This is your "window" into what the engine is doing at that particular throttle position. You only need to run the bike for about 1 mile. You are looking for a nice caramel color around the base of the center electrode, down inside. It's hard to see down in there, that's why they call it "chopping" because to get a real good look you have to cut the plug. Do a google search of plug chop and you will find lots of information. It's not hard and it is the only real way to tell how the motor is really running. You don't really have to chop the plugs either, you just have to be able to see way down in there.
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I like the idea of the air filter, and don't forget you also have the jet needle to fine tune with. It's easier to see results here, because of the access. Get it as close as poss. w/ the jet, and then see where the needle takes you. Everything must work together to get a smooth response across the board.
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what is the jet needle..is that the same thing as the mix screw? and which one is the mix screw or jet needle. the only one I see to adjust is the idle screw.
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The jet needle is inside the carb. It sticks out of the bottom of the slide. You access it by unscrewing the top of the carb where the throttle cable enters. The idle screw is usually the screw in the center. It sticks in to where the slide is and changes the idle by either raising or lowering the starting point of the slide. The mix screw is usually just forward of the idle and a little lower. If you pull the screws all the way out, the tip of the idle screw is larger than the mix also.
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This is what I know.. I have done 6 scooters all of them GY6 4 strokes.. I have put on the big bore kits. I can tell you the upgrade to power is amazing.. Install can take an hour or 2 on the first one. The second only takes an hour at the most. Again.. These have all bee GY6 139qmb engines.. Here in Colorado, you must be 16 with a valid drivers license in order to drive a 49cc scooter. You must also have the Low power sticker and valid insurance. You do not need to have a motor cycle endorsement . Once you Get the VIN, proof of insurance , then you can get the low power sticker from Colo Dept of Revenue, and then you are legal provided you are 16 with a valid drivers license. Now.. About the Power up kit.. Who is going to know? And how would they know? By adding a power up kit to your 4 stroke, you will be able to do 45mph on the flats and up hills.. You will no longer be hugging the white line at 30mph or 35 on a good day.. The power up kits will only help everyone !! Cars will not be angry with you.. Besides.. The power up kits for the 4 strokes will allow the 4 strokes to go like the stock 2 strokes .. Maybe a little more.. Maybe.. But.. REally. About the same.. The power up kits really are needed for the 4 strokes as they really are slow out of the box.. And they, or they have been easy to do and worth every penny ..
Now.. With that.. I must say that I have never done a Kymco 4 stroke.. But I am going to.. I just bought a very nice Kymco Agility 50T 4S with 800 miles. It is a stock all the way scooter.. Slow for sure.. Runs ok.. But does not make the power.. It is a 50 4 stroke.. So.. I have been doing a search for a Power up kit for the Kymco. From what I can tell. It is the same kit for the GY6 139qmb as for the Kymco. And I still have a spare power up kit for the 139qmb .. Yes !! So.. Keep Posted. I will let you all know how this power up Kit goes for this Kymco 4 stroke.
As for all the other power up kits I have installed.. I can tell you.. it is worth it big time !! I have done 4 of my own scooters, and 1 customer scooter.. And all have been fantastic !! The only thing I install is the new cylinder , piston, and ring sets. That is all.. Keep everything else the same.. What you want to do is this. Make sure your scooter is running correctly before you attempt to install any big bore/power up kit. If you have a good running scooter, then once you are done with the power up kit, you will be amazed.. No Carb Change is needed, no change in jetting is needed.. Simply install the base Gasket, new cylinder with piston and rings, and new Crush Head Gasket.. That is all !! And once you are done, you too will be amazed. You will have a blast !! I will do a video on this Kymco Scooter using the GY6 139QMB big bore kit.. So.. Keep in touch !! And.. Enjoy the ride !!
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Interesting you say no change in jetting was needed Dax cos as far as i was aware everyone here who did it had to upjet on a BBK?
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Seems funny no jetting is needed but maybe the airflow through the stock airbox and
exhaust limits the power gain so you don't need much extra fuel. So you probably get 1
hp and with a few tweaks to intake and exhaust you could get 2 hp....
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you will be able to do 45mph on the flats and up hills..
..my 08 a50 did that without kit...hmmm...
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Maybe an aftermarket 70cc makes less power than the stock 50cc?
I know some Chinese scoots make a lot less power than the name brands.
From the EPA a Qlink 150 makes 6.5 kw and the Kymco movie 150 makes 9.9 kw.
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you will be able to do 45mph on the flats and up hills..
..my 08 a50 did that without kit...hmmm...
x 2 mine does 45 or better with a 20 mm carb and a 85 jet. and open air box.
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as far as i was aware everyone here who did it had to upjet on a BBK
...oh, hell...i know several ppl that didnt...aint running now....
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Only so much can be done befor the bang hits you. its better off just geting a bigger scoot.
everyone that does the bbk is just another way of geting buy so you dont have to get a cycle endorsement.
and dont have to worry about insurance.................. thats why we drive 50.s
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ok.. I just wanted to state, that I have a Vitality 50cc 4 stroke and not an agility.. But at any rate.. My Vitality would top out at 32mph and it would take a while to get there. Keep in mind I am at 6000 feet in altitude which may explain why I do not need to change any jetting. For those at sea level, you may need to go one fatter. Simple to do and should take no more than 15-20 mins to jet one fatter. Anyway.. I have finished installing my power up big bore kit and can now hit 42-44 mph and have gobs more torque. Again.. Keep in mind, I am at 6000 feet Bone Stocke scooter, and any where I go is up from here. Taking a scooter or dirt bike to over 12,000 feet is common for me. The general rule is 4 percent power loss for every 1000 feet. Since we have little or no humidity here in Colorado, the racers equate us at 9000 feet where I am . So.. Doing a little math, that means.. Typically I am down 36 percent in horse power as compared with those of you at lower altitudes. So.. I can do 42 mph up here which is pretty darn good for being down almost 40 percent in HP. Before, I could only hit 32 mph and it would take a while.. I can only imagine what kind of power I would have at sea level.. That would feel like a shot of NOS to me I am sure.. The Power up kit or big bore kit I used was the typical 139QMB big bore kit . It was easy to install as you can see in the Video. My 4 Stroke will now run with the stocker 2 strokes, and it is not broken it yet. So..It will get a lot faster with time.. A lot faster !! . So.. For those of you interested in powering up your 4 stroke for less than 100 bucks.. Check out my video. !! And.. Enjoy the ride... :)
Here is a Link to the Clip on Youtube.
http://youtu.be/Q95qcTD8q00 (http://youtu.be/Q95qcTD8q00)