KymcoForum.com
General => Technical | How To => Topic started by: EvilTessmacher on August 23, 2018, 04:10:10 PM
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Grab your favorite beverage, and sit back. This is going to be a long one.
Big photos on request.
This turned out to be a much easier job than I had originally anticipated. The only major issues encountered were before the project, in finding the exact connector plug needed. The wiring diagram for the bike, as well as the Service Manual did come in handy, and helped explain to me what I needed to be able to visualize before I started.
Tools needed:
- #2 phillips screwdriver
- #1 phillips screwdriver (preferably with a flexible shaft)
- 10mm socket, and long extension
- Solder and soldering iron
- Heat-shrink tubing and heat gun
- 1 pair JST-PH 2 pin connectors, from Vetco Electronics (https://tinyurl.com/yc8dbftj (https://tinyurl.com/yc8dbftj))
Wiring Diagram: https://tinyurl.com/ychumaks (https://tinyurl.com/ychumaks)
Service Manual, Ch-1 – Exterior Body Panels: https://tinyurl.com/yb4nw9sx (https://tinyurl.com/yb4nw9sx)
Here's what I did:
First, I removed the luggage bucket, making sure to unplug the compartment light. Very important. The Service Manual explains in good detail how to do this. I learned that one does not have to remove the battery cover to remove the luggage bucket. You’ll need a #2 phillips screwdriver, and a 10MM socket with a 4†extension to complete the job.
(https://image.ibb.co/ccaQ7e/19197.png)
Next, I removed the two covers over the OEM turn signals. Here’s an image to show what they are, from the service manual. Note the green arrow. These are in the same location on each side. There’s a lot of frame and other items in the way, so it won’t be as easy to get to as this image shows.
(https://image.ibb.co/bDhNgU/tail_011.png)
I used the flexible screwdriver with a 1/4†socket and a #1 phillips bit to take the screws out. There’s one on each side of each cover. If you have a magnetized screwdriver bit it will help. I dropped all four screws because I don’t have magnetized bits, and I had to scramble around on the garage floor to find them. I wish I’d put something like a blanket under the bike to catch dropped stuff. So learn from my mistake!
I got tired of stuff sliding off the pan under the luggage bucket, and so I found an old fiberglass lunch tray from a school (probably 50 years old or more) and put a piece of that white foam on top of it. It fit perfectly in the space where the luggage bucket goes, and enabled me to have all my tools handy. The foam kept stuff from sliding around.
(https://image.ibb.co/mPnyaz/T1566.png)
Once I got both covers off, I drilled a 1/10†hole in each one, because the leads from the new plug are going to have to go through the covers. There’s a weather seal on each cover, so they have to go through. More on this later.
(https://image.ibb.co/eX8t8K/T35141.png)
It was hell the ruggedest mile getting these tiny plugs into those tiny sockets. I couldn’t figure out why the plugs wouldn’t seat in the sockets, even though I had them lined up, and then I saw there was a very tiny little plastic rib on the plug.
(https://image.ibb.co/nggMfz/7363.png)
Shave this rib off with an X-acto or razor blade. Carefully. But it has to go, or the plug won’t seat in the socket.
I had to make a tool to manipulate the plug, (you can see how small it is) so I took a bamboo chopstick. (Yes, just like you get at a sushi bar) and dremeled out a little notch in the fat end that was just barely big enough to fit the plug. Holding the wires against the shaft of the chopstick, I was able to seat the plug in the socket. And no, I didn’t get a pic of this operation, as both hands were occupied, but I did take one of the seated plug.
(https://image.ibb.co/hhDOtK/35355.png)
From here on out, it was easy as could be. Getting that plug seated in the socket was the most difficult part of the entire project.
At this point, I put the covers back on, and threaded the leads through the holes I’d drilled. I took the other end of the chopstick and applied a little glob of 100% pure silicone around the hole to weatherproof it.
(https://image.ibb.co/jANLoK/T08265.png)
Here’s where it got interesting.
I reasoned that since the pumpkin-stalk turn signals already had connectors (of the bullet variety) that hooked into the wiring harness, I could re-use them for this application. So, I removed the stalk turn signals, and clipped off the wiring leaving about 4" of wire with the connectors. It was a simple matter of then determining exactly what the polarity was, and so I took a break, and came inside to hit the interwebz to research it. I found a neat little device on Instructables that enables one to light up for test purposes, 12V LED lights. Made from a power supply from a printer, no less. A couple of alligator clips soldered on, and I was in business.
(https://image.ibb.co/cXqNLz/4197.png)
The best thing about this little contraption is that it was free. Everyone has spare DC converters lying around, and I happened to have a pack of alligator clips in the shop, so it was merely a matter of reading the label to see which side was hot and which was neutral, and I soldered on the appropriate color clip. This enabled me to test the lights at each step of the process, to ensure that I was connecting the right thing to the right thing. And I tested everything at every step. The wiring diagram told me that GREEN wires are ground/neutral, so the other color wire goes to the hot side, and that was that.
I soldered the male bullet connector to the end of the appropriate colored lead from the new plug, and covered it with the appropriate color (red or black as the case may be) heat shrink tube.
(https://image.ibb.co/khnaNe/T307804.png)
(https://image.ibb.co/errySe/23386.png)
(https://image.ibb.co/jJY4Fz/T47769.png)
From this point, it was merely a matter of isolating the correct wires on both sides (testing as I went along to make sure the LEDs lit up) and connecting the right bullet connector to the right wire. A total of four solder connections, and that was that.
(https://image.ibb.co/erhmTK/T49322.png)
Once all four sets of connections (hot and neutral on two sides) were made, heat-shrinked, the bullet connectors were re-connected together, and all the wires were tucked in and held in place with small cable zip ties, I was able to put it all back together. Do the reverse of taking it apart, silly! And now I have the OEM LED turn signals operational.
(https://image.ibb.co/gSFJaz/T45454.png)
I don’t know much about electrical, but I do know that LED turn signals have a hyperflash problem. And so my turn signals flash about twice as fast as they used to, but oddly, when I turn the hazard flashers on, they flash at the same speed as they always did. So, I suspect that I am going to have to change out the relay for the flashers. As soon as I find out what the exact specifications for the correct flasher rely are, I’m going to order one, and install it.
Here’s a link to an 11-second video showing both signals operating as the Hazard Flashers.
https://vimeo.com/286369596 (https://vimeo.com/286369596)
From start to finish, not counting the breaks, required about three hours time. And only that long because I took my time, and considered carefully what my next step would be, and I tested every connection as I went along. It really wasn’t a bad little project for part of the day.
One other thing I did while I had the back end open, was add running lights in the place of the old pumpkin stalks. I got a set of 3/4" red Eagle Eye LEDs from Ebay, and they were even easier to add in than the turn signals were. The wiring diagram enabled me to find the wiring to the license-plate light, and that’s what I hooked into. I used something called “Posi-Taps†which are the greatest thing since sliced bread. They can be found here: https://www.posi-products.com/posiplug.html (https://www.posi-products.com/posiplug.html) I used the EX-100R size, and let me tell you, these things are fantastic. Regrettably, I didn’t take any photos of the installation, but here’s what I did. First, I ran the leads from the Eagle Eyes through the hole in the rear fender (one on each side) where the old leads from the pumpkin-stalks went, and connected each side to the other. Red to red, and black to black. I then took another length (about a foot long) of 24ga wire, and connected one end of that to the two paired leads of the Eagle Eyes. Soldered connections and heat-shrinked. I then isolated the green wire to the license light, and connected the black lead of the 24ga to it with the Posi-tap. I did the same to the brown wire from the red lead and that was that. They lit up like a Christmas tree, according to my dad, who wondered what I’d been doing in the garage all morning. Here’s photos:
(https://image.ibb.co/gz1rvz/T8430.png)
And lit up:
(https://image.ibb.co/kutRTK/T28404.png)
Those Eagle Eyes are bright! I rode over to the convenience store to grab a lottery ticket for my wife last night, and I swear, they actually illuminate the road! I could plainly see them lighting up the side of the road as I went by. Stuff on the sidewalk, all kinds of things. When I go to work tonight, I’ll take a photo so you all can see just how bright these things really are.
I hope this tutorial helps those of you who are going to convert your turn signals. There will also be one for the front, once I get to it.
Ed
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What all besides the tools did you need for this, I am absolutely looking to do this!
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Alexis: Everything I needed (and used) is listed at the beginning of the post. Except for the handy-dandy 12v tester I made, and it's shown in the body. It's all there. Solder, heat gun, everything.
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First of all: THANK YOU. As daft as I am on electrical, your instructions seem pretty straight forward and at this point I think I fully understand them. I even understood the part about the polarity testing.
Second: Are you changing the front also? The reason I ask is because right now you have mixed lights on the winker relay. Once they are both LED, won't that make them match for the blink rate so it is normal again? No, I don't know. This was my understanding from reading about another scooter conversion, so it may be completely my misunderstanding.
Edit: I save this page as an HTML file on my local drive for future reference!!!!!!
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Alexis: Everything I needed (and used) is listed at the beginning of the post. Except for the handy-dandy 12v tester I made, and it's shown in the body. It's all there. Solder, heat gun, everything.
Oh the vetco part wasn’t loading for me earlier or something, Thank you so much for this!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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First of all: THANK YOU. As daft as I am on electrical, your instructions seem pretty straight forward and at this point I think I fully understand them. I even understood the part about the polarity testing.
Second: Are you changing the front also? The reason I ask is because right now you have mixed lights on the winker relay. Once they are both LED, won't that make them match for the blink rate so it is normal again? No, I don't know. This was my understanding from reading about another scooter conversion, so it may be completely my misunderstanding.
Edit: I save this page as an HTML file on my local drive for future reference!!!!!!
Happy to be of service! That's what this forum is for. I only wish someone else had done it before I did, so I didn't have to make it up as I went along.
I'm not knowledgeable at all about electrical/electronics, but I did ask a few questions of some people locally I know who are, and they helped me understand some of what was going on with the systems, and how everything would be connected. As long as I maintained the pathways for the electrical power, and didn't introduce anything new into the turn signal circuit, it would be okay. And it has.
As far as the flash speed issue, I don't think that's how it works. The electrical resistance of the incandescent bulbs in the stalks was "eating up"some of the juice, and so it took time for them to send it back through the relay. The LEDs don't use as much power, and so there's a lot more that can go back to the relay, and faster, hence the speed increase. Adding more LEDs in the front isn't going to make much difference, so I will definitely need a new relay. I just have to find out which one. There are hundreds of them to choose from.
Oh the vetco part wasn’t loading for me earlier or something, Thank you so much for this!
It was there, but I went in and edited the link so that might have had something to do with it not showing in its entirety.
You're very welcome.
As for the front ones, I'm going to make my own turn signals, as I don't think I can get European/Asian ones in the US. I have to get the empty housings and add in my own LEDs.
And I am going to post another tutorial on that process, whenever I get to it.
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Nicely done! [emoji106]
Why do scooters and motorcycles in the US have to have turn signals separated from the body?
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Outstanding, ET! OK, your next assignment is to post a sequential description of body panel removal with pictures. An' after that a complete rewrite of the Service Manual for all English speaking countries. Better yet, both you and Stig are now detailed to do this. No hurry. Next week is fine.
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Nicely done! [emoji106]
Why do scooters and motorcycles in the US have to have turn signals separated from the body?
Not separate from the body. It is the distance between them. When scooters are made more narrow, then the stalks are used to spread the distance to meet DOT manufacturers regulations.
Edit: I did a lookup on the NHTSA site and the pdf they have says minimum distance 16" between the indicators.
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Not separate from the body. It is the distance between them. When scooters are made more narrow, then the stalks are used to spread the distance to meet DOT manufacturers regulations.
Edit: I did a lookup on the NHTSA site and the pdf they have says minimum distance 16" between the indicators.
Ok, tnx for the info!
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Outstanding, ET! OK, your next assignment is to post a sequential description of body panel removal with pictures. An' after that a complete rewrite of the Service Manual for all English speaking countries. Better yet, both you and Stig are now detailed to do this. No hurry. Next week is fine.
Please don't wait on me to do this. In fact, don't hold your breath that I ever will. I am afraid to remove much of the bodywork at all. I am afraid I will break something, or otherwise screw something up, and I don't want to do that.
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Also, and for the record, I think I have found the correct relay to stop the hyperflash. I won't know it for sure until I get one and replace the OEM one, but I think this one is it.
It's the Electronic LED Flasher Relays for Motorcycle Part Number: LF1-S-FLAT from SuperBrightLEDs and can be found here:
https://tinyurl.com/ycesg7ka
The only thing about it I'm sure I won't like, is that it's a silent relay. No clicking for turn signal.
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The only thing about it I'm sure I won't like, is that it's a silent relay. No clicking for turn signal.
This could help
https://youtu.be/j1JBn7240yY
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This could help
https://youtu.be/j1JBn7240yY
That's a great product. And if I were a little more confident with my electrical abilities I might consider it. It is, regrettably, adding something in to the circuit, which is a thing I was advised against by a local friend whom I asked for electrical advice when starting this project. She said that as long as I didn't add anything into the circuit, I'd be okay. I'm going to take her at her word. Another thing that troubles me are those blue connectors. I've seen YouTube videos where they slice those 24 and 26ga wires right in half. I'd rather use Posi-taps if I were going to do anything.
Thanks for posting that vid. It would indeed be one solution to my issue.
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Those connectors work really good in my experience. Have a few of them on my motorcycle.
Used them instead of Posi Taps that are better, but these work just fine.
I'm not a electrician, but did put a pair of fog lights, a USB charger for GPS, and a gear position/voltmeter/temp display myself.
Used common sense, a few motorcycle forums and asked a friend that is a electrician.
You're on a roll, don't stop now! [emoji3]
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Must use the right gauge clips for the correct size wire with those in the video.
Another thing I do, I use the pliers like he did, BUT I clip the blade down BEFORE folding over the cap.
You can see the blade start to come through the cap.
By clipping it before you close the cap, you can make sure the blade is completely seated and even.
The cap can even be closed by hand then.
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It all comes down to doing what works, staying within one's comfort zone, and the shared experiences of like-minded individuals on forums like this one...
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Just did this yesterday, accidentally only ordered a single cable, so I desoldered the female end from the board, and soldered in my own wires straight to one of the boards.
Absolutely love the look of the OEM turn signals
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Dude, you got a lot more guts than me. I wouldn't fool with a PCB if my life depended on it. Too much opportunity to screw it up permanently.
And you gotta post pics or it didn't happen! ;D ;D