KymcoForum.com
Scooters - 50cc => Like 50 2T => Topic started by: wassonii on July 11, 2012, 08:29:30 PM
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In and around the rain, I have gotten them installed and made an initial test run.
1500 torque spring is in and rear pulley has been cleaned, regreased, and cleaned again (but it is externally grease-free!).
1500 fly springs are in.
Top Racing/Jasil variator is in.
Everything works.
Just after install, rain was starting to fall, so I only had time for a quick start up and rode a few hundred feet back and forth before the bottom fell out.
In between the rains, I was able to check my nuts (I am ocd when it comes to checking them and making sure that they stay in place), make some marks for when I check them again, and ride for about a mile or so before the next wave of rain came in.
At present, I have 8.5g weights in (with the 1000 spring and stock vari I had run 7.7g and then 8g. For a brief turn I had run 9g, but those were way to heavy for only the 1000 spring) and will play with weights, but I am unsure whether I will try moving down to 8g or if moving up to 9 wouldn't be better. At any rate, takeoff is much improved with the new flys and acceleration is definitely smoother. I'll sit on this setup for at least a few days for the vari to start breaking in and the springs to do their thing. At present, the freshest belt I had on hand was a Gates Powerlink, but I will be throwing a stock in there after payday.
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Sounds sweet. I can't wait to see how it does when you get to really run it.
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You were absolutely right about the difference a 1500 spring would make. Being the tactile learner I am, I do know now, though, that 1000 just ain't enough. I'll get some pics the next time I open her up. The only camera we have is my wife's and she'd be a little peeved at grease and belt dust on all of the buttons:) As always, thanks for the advice!
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;D ;D :-*
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..the 1500 is the key to tuning your cvt...
..oh yeah!!..welcome to a whole new world!!!
:o
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I'm jelly wassonii! My scoot shop tried to tell me that a "1500 is unnecessary strain on the drive belt" but I'm still following zombie's advice... he knows what's up. Got a new spring and weights on the way, finally got upjetted to an 85 and there's an 82 in the mail to see if that'd be better (seems like I'm a little boggy at the time). I was right that the shop didn't upjet it, even though I'd asked them to, which means that pinging I've been hearing was it running lean >:(
Got the idle screw adjusted correctly, too. Don't trust anyone with my scoot except myself and zombie and the others on this forum, I've learned. Enjoy your practically new ride wass! Glad to hear you're getting close to perfect.
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It's all good Bro! Thanx for the props.
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Always listen to the voice(s) of experience.
Word, it definitely is.
Psuffix, though you may be a little lean, Kymco ships with a 78 in the carb and with the oem exhaust, you aren't (or at least shouldn't be) doing any permanent damage. Apparently at some point in their existence prior to 2011, they would send as a part of their derestrict kit with the smooth boss an 85 jet. When they changed it to 82 my dealer asked them why and their reply was that in their testing they couldn't really tell a difference.
Now, I am going to admit some stupidity here: in my haste to get started on the fine tuning of my cvt (and because I am a cheap bastard), I ordered a set of minarelli fly springs. Partsforscooters was waiting on their shipment with the qmb springs and I didn't want to wait, nor did I want to pay somebody else's price plus shipping. They are currently installed, but will get swapped out tomorrow when the new set arrives from pfs. I write this, psuffix, so you don't make a similar mistake. (Fortunately, I'm only out 10bucks and a little bit of around town use won't kill my clutch or pop the springs). Make sure to order correct parts the first time.
And for the record, my dealer/mechanic basically said the same thing about a torque spring when I started inquiring. I don't know if it's that they haven't tried such a thing, or if they don't want the hassle of helping tune. In my case, I kind of lean toward it being the latter, especially because it's a little shop attached to a dealership whose new scoot business has been almost outgrowing the size of the work area. They have been taking delivery of quite a few new crated scoots this year and it was only around January that they hired a second mechanic.
All that being said, psuffix, if you haven't already gotten some, get a bottle of Seafoam (walmart or your local auto parts store) and add an ounce per gallon of fuel when you fill up. That stuff is worth it's weight in gold as far as keeping the fuel system clean. I don't remember if in your post you had already gotten some, but figured it wouldn't hurt to put the info out here.
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"In my case, I kind of lean toward it being the latter, especially because it's a little shop attached to a dealership whose new scoot business has been almost outgrowing the size of the work area. They have been taking delivery of quite a few new crated scoots this year and it was only around January that they hired a second mechanic."
Are you referring to "All About Scooters"? Tallihasse?
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No sirrah. Down here in Vero, there be but one.
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Hey Wass... Have you considered coming up to Carrabelle for the Labor day bit? Even a day or so would be great! None of us have ever met on the street so it should prove to be one hell of a time! If you have the chance to pop up it sure would be nice. Like I said... Lodging is a non issue up here if you decide to hang out a bit. Wives/GF's/freinds/kids/pets, all welcome.
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I would love to come and chill, but my wife is due around then (actual due date is 12 september, but doc said he may be about 9 days off (earlier delivery).
It does sound, though, like Carabelle is my kind of spot and y'all would damn sure be a good group to chill with.
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Well great luck for you, and yours... Kids do come first.
Our insurance company paid for 4 days stay at the hospital when my daughter was born. After 24 hrs. I brought home my baby girl, and left my wife at the hospital. I know ...F'n no wonder He's single... After stopping at the hospital in the AM for her "feeding" I packed her up, and we went to opening day Trout fishing. Stopped by the hospital for another feeding, and convinced my wife to check out. She always said I loved my daughter better than her. She was right.
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Opening day fishing is awesome (and a damn rite of passage)! Good on you for bringing that baby into the world right!
I think our insurance gives us 24 hours total. But yes, kids do come first.
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Ours was 24hrs for the baby, and 4 days for the mom. Go figure they let a baby go but they "prefer" the mom to stay. $$$$$$$$$$$$$
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You know that insurance man is gonna get his change come hell or high water ::)
As to vari life...
While I wait for the correct set of clutch springs, I was feeling a little froggy and put in the set of 7.5g weights. The 8.5 was just a touch too heavy. Not quite the boggy feeling of the 9g I tried with the 1000rpm spring, but still not getting into the powerband as quickly as should have been the case.
I would like to take a moment to note that the Gates belt, now for the second time, has limited top speed to 40. I didn't measure when I first got it, but feel after some practicum on the scoot (and reading other's tales of its' use) that it is likely about 1-2mm shorter than a Kymco belt. But, back to the weights....
The 7.5 set def gets into the powerband better and quicker but my jury is out as to if they are more effective than a set of 8g (which will be the next set I try).
Bear in mind that my pipe is the Tecnigas Silent Sport and is not a true chamber. When I eventually get some change together (after a new carb, the reality of weekly diaper expense, etc, etc...) I will go to a chamber, I feel, but then I will get the pleasure of roller trials all over again:) In reality, though, the vari has only been in use for about a hundred or so kilometers, which will affect the overall once it is 'broken in'.
I should get the set of springs Monday and will install them either then or Tuesday morning. I want to give the 7.5 set a chance to show me what everyday use is going to be like before putting in the 8's. That way I shall have a benchmark and can chose which will be best overall. (Hell, I may see what the 7.7g set is like, too, just to see. Each is going to show different characteristics...but you knew that).
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Now, here's a question:
I know the Kymco is the preferred belt, but I'm looking at the Malossi line (since they give good measurements http://www.malossi.com/news/newsDoc/PDF_PRODOTTI/DIM%20CINGHIE_001.pdf (http://www.malossi.com/news/newsDoc/PDF_PRODOTTI/DIM%20CINGHIE_001.pdf) ) and I'm wondering...
The universally recommended Malossi belt for this 2t engine type of Kymco 50cc is # 6111153 with specifications of 18mm wide, 9mm thick, 738mm external measurement, and 28 degree angle, and is only available in kevlar.
Here is why I ask:
At present, after a few test runs, the Kymco belt is easily sitting about a half an inch or better below the rim of the clutch. What kind of evil would I invoke if I tried Malossi belt # 6112735 with specifications of 18mm wide, 8mm thick, 755mm external measurement, and 32 degree angle? The differences being same width, 1mm thinner (not so heinous), 17mm longer (about 2/3 inch longer), and different angle. The length I think would be alright (I know I need to measure in the clutch and do the sharpie on the vari trick to see how much more travel could be incurred), but what happens with the angle difference?
For the record, this is the non-kevlar version of this belt (tho a kevlar version exists) and while Racing Planet has it for sale, it is specified for a variety of Peugot scoots.
Of note, the Malossi belt specified at Racing Planet (and elsewhere) for several of the Kymco 50cc 4t models is belt # 6113501 with length of 743mm and angle of 30 degrees (width and thickness being the same as # 6111153; also only available in kevlar).
Just curious...
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..grab a belt, throw it in...
..if it works, keep it..if not then grab another..throw it in...if it works keep it..if not then grab another..if it works, keep it..if not then grag another..throw it in..if it works keep it...if not then grab another..if it works keep it..if not then grab another....
:o
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743mm ... The only issue is the angle. That angle is put on the belt to get it to squeeze tighter on the cover of the belt. That is where all the strength is. The issue is Kevlar will grove the aluminum, and tear pits out of the steel. I would save the Malossi 30* for the track, and find a different angle for the street.
You do need a longer belt but that one is fire IMHO.
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743mm ... The only issue is the angle. That
.check out my latest HiT posts....
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and find a different angle for the street.
..thats it!!!
..what you wanna run??
..top end fast or take-off...
..there's a balance, but wow...
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..if you got the money honey, we got your disease...
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age old question and right up there with the oldest profession. Angle question answered. Groovy is good. Grooves, not so much. Been watching the HiT progression. Great pic tutorial, but the caveat is emptor'ed. Those cracks in the Naraku are crazy-lookin.
Off to do more research...
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With a stock belt installed, the best performance thus far (and what will become the benchmark in my tuning to the 1500 spring) has been with the Jasil 15% spring and 8 gram rollers. Good throttle response throughout and about 45mph sustained top speed. (The speedo actually went a little higher, but mine is about 1-2 mph pff once I get above 35).
Prior to this discovery and with the 1500 contra in, the set of 7.5g weights were too light, though it wasn't too heinous. At present, I am testing out the 8g weights with the 1500 spring with (so far) good throttle response and a top speed of 43-44mph (speedo at 45). Tomorrow I will revisit the 8.5g weights.
I did get the proper clutch springs installed - I don't have to tell you folks what a difference a proper set of clutch springs will make. (The Minarelli springs will "fit", but the clutch reaction was about the same as having the stock springs in and damn they were a bitch to get out - of course I am now considering a set of 2000 rpm clutch springs, but who didn't see that coming ;))
Further Back and Faster
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So exactly what was wrong with the springs you got? Wrong stiffness or just wrong part?
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They were for a minarelli stock clutch. Slightly different shape to the hooks and size of the coils. I pitched them, else I'd take a pic. Too, the coils for the minarelli springs are slightly larger than those for the kymco.
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I got a wild hair and tried the set of 9g rollers. Glad I didn't waste my time on the 8.5 set. Preliminary results are very similar to the 1000 spring with the 8g set. Takeoff is a little sluggish compared to that setup (should be able to be rectified with a set of 2000rpm fly springs), but overall throttle response, sound, and feel is quite good, with sustained top speed similar to the 1000/8s. I'll get out and about tomorrow to really take her for a spin. I wish I had a set of 9.5s to try. I may get some 10s from PFS (they don't do sets in .5 increments) just to see what happens. I did order a Malossi Torsion Controller, but don't know which spring I'll try it out on, since it will cause the torque spring to act a little stiffer.
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You are getting into a high maintence zone with those heavy rollers. I was going thru alot of parts running a red/9.5s
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Agreed. I can tell a sound difference with the 9's (there's a throatier sound anyway with the stiffer spring, but the 9s has a different tone with use. After having ridden it around town, it's characteristics started to change. I went back to the 1000 spring with 8s in, since I won't have testing time (or weather) for another week or so. MPG has suffered a little in these trials, too, though that was to be expected.
After this crazy work-week and tomorrow's potential weather, I will get another chance for testing. I think, though, that I would rather do my testing with a Jasil 22% spring. Nothing against Hoca, but I think Jasil makes better parts for the long haul. For instance, the Jasil spring has its' paint with some rub marks after a few weeks of use and being installed/removed a few times. The Hoca has its' paint scraped away in places after only a week. I know the paint is a minor point, but it makes more sense to stay within a manufacturer's offerings when doing testing, especially if there is a known good result against which to compare. I'll probably get a set of stiffer Jasil fly's as well.
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I'm new to Jasil myself but am very happy with my Vars, and rollers from them. The rollers are top quality. Equal to Malossi.
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Once I started dialing in the weight to a good range, top speed increased by about 5mph with my vari, so all I have to say is thanks for the recommend.
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Same result I have. It's kicked Malossi to the curb for variators. I think the only Malossi I am running now are their springs, and decals. So far I like the contra springs, and the torsion controller. The controller works more like a shim to pre load than a twisty thing but it is another nice tool to have.
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Wow, sounds awesome! You're using the 1000 contra and 8g roller weights?
Well, glad I waited a day, might just get the Jasil variator by the way you guys are talking it up. Was considering it, anyway, since it's supposed to have better acceleration and that's what I need the most.
What's top speed right now, wass? 52 or so?
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Top speed is 45-46 under perfect conditions, versus 40-41 with stock vari and the same set-up (yes 1000 spring (Jasil 15%) and 8g weights).
I put a set of 8.5g weights in and while top speed held longer, takeoff suffered a bit. I may revisit that weight set of rollers if I get a set of 2000rpm fly springs.
When I first got the Jasil vari, I did have some issues with the install, in that the fan blades were catching on the inside of the case. I believe it to have been due to the boss length being 39mm instead of the stock's 38mm, though operator error could have been involved. (At the time, I didn't have replacement nuts for the shafts, so didn't test it very well).
I took mine to a cylinder shop here in town and they milled it down to the same length as the stock boss for no charge and some good conversation.
Steve at Moped Hospital had had no problem with the Jasil/Top Racing vari in an earlier model year Like 50, so just an fyi.
Also, regarding top speed, bear in mind that the exhaust I have is rated only a little better than stock and I weigh about 240 and am 6'6".
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Yeah I read your whole ordeal about the terrible sound you were hearing from the variator. I've read of using an extra rubber gasket to raise the CVT case a little for that extra mm. Maybe I could order an OEM part just in case. Cutting the boss is always an option, but I wouldn't mind having that extra mm (affects low speed acceleration slight, I think, since the vari can travel out a little further?)
Oh yeah, and I'm 6' 140 lbs. I was picking up some 2T oil today and walked into a conversation about weight and scooters. They were telling me that acceleration isn't really going to be a problem for me.
Oh and have you read this thread about the seat? http://www.kymcoforum.com/index.php?topic=6171.0 (http://www.kymcoforum.com/index.php?topic=6171.0)
It's from the 200i thread but I assume the body is the same... mine also has the pointless defect. Should be easy to cut out with a Dremel. kriden also has a tutorial for connecting the dummy indicator lights on the front of the scoot, something I'll probably be doing as well.
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It never hurts to have an extra case gasket. Even if you don't use it for this purpose, it is a good thing to have on hand in case something happens while dialling in the vari.
At 140, there will be no issue with acceleration and maintaining speed. Heck, I haven't seen 140 in maaaany moons.
I do keep up with the 200i thread. I am interested in making some changes in that seat. With the length of my legs, it makes sense to redo that hump.
I hadn't explored the indicator bits yet, though. Merci!
With the new boss being the same length as stock, there hasn't been an issue with low gearing. Had I gone any further, though, there might have been.
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Have to ask... which of these is the one you ordered? I'm guessing the middle one for the People and Super 9
http://www.mhr-usa.com/index.php?target=mopeds&mode=mopeds_search&subcats=Y&cid=687&moped_brand_id=128&moped_model_id= (http://www.mhr-usa.com/index.php?target=mopeds&mode=mopeds_search&subcats=Y&cid=687&moped_brand_id=128&moped_model_id=)
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Yes. http://www.mhr-usa.com/scooter-variator-kits/jasil-sv1-variator-kit-for-kymco-2-stroke-clone-2.html (http://www.mhr-usa.com/scooter-variator-kits/jasil-sv1-variator-kit-for-kymco-2-stroke-clone-2.html)
CODE: JA6040440
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One combination I hadn't yet tried with the Top Racing 15% spring in (1000) was with the 7.5g weight set. Yesterday I noticed a little bit of sluggishness in the mid-range with the 8s in. On a whim, this morning I put the 7.5s in and at present, I have a new favorite set. Definitely a little punchier in take-off and throughout throttle response and still maintains top speed of 45-46. I won't be able to test out 7g worth of weight (using a combo of 6.5 and 7.5 from the set that came with the vari) until next week at some point, but I may give it a go. I have the Malossi torsion controller on order and when I install that, I may find with the pre-load that I return to the 8s, though we shall see. Money is super tight right now, but I will eventually get the intake from RP and probably upgrade the carb, too. At some point before or after the carb, I will also look into the Naraku cdi to see if that has any effect.
Once the bug hits, it never ends...bliss
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Malossi Torsion Controller came in a few days ago, but this morning was the first opportunity I have had to install it. Don't have the funds just yet to get a different make stiffer spring, so put it in with the Hoca 1500 and revisited the 8.5g set of weights. So far, very nice. Truth will out after some regular day-riding and warmer than A.M. temps.
In the last few days, I had become disenchanted with the 1000 spring setup. Takeoff was suffering in the heat of the day and acceleration wasn't doing too well, either. I haven't ruled out that the 88 mj may be a tad too rich, but I'm not changing it out for the 85 without some fresh plugs on hand.
At any rate, that Malossi piece really does wonders for the feel of everything (or rather smoothness).
I do think I will need to get a set of 2000 fly springs and after a few days, I may revisit the 9g set of weights.
Once I went 1500, nothing else felt right, I reckon. I just needed some different bits to get it right (or at least back on the right track).
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It is an interesting battle getting the cvt right. It's too tempting to make several changes at once to save repeated labor. BUT if you do just One thing at a time, and bust your knuckles twice it does work out better. Slinger loves all the tinkering, and tweaking... I dread it. I usually aim for the lightest rollers that allow full rpm/top speed. first. It is easier for me to tell the Diff. by working my way heavier
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I'd rather scrape some flesh and use copious amounts of loctite, too.
I'm in a quandary. There are 2 things I know I need to perk this scoot up (well, three, really, but the bbk is going to wait for a very long time. Years, really...)
A carb, which we have discussed, and an expansion chamber.
This Silent Sport has been alright, certainly better than stock, but it's time to move on.
Tecnigas Next R, Leo Vince ZX R, and Stage 6 Pro Replica are all roughly in the price range I seek (with shipping costs factored in). If I didn't have to consider cost, jiang or Yasuni would be in the mix.
I'm kind of thinking I should lay out for a pipe now and then come into a carb later. What do you think, maestro?
If I get a carb now, it will be several months until a pipe and vice versa. I could go cheap on a carb to speed up the process, but I just can't settle for less than Dellorto knowing what I do now.
My thinking is that it might be better to get a pipe sooner, tune what I have to it and then when I can afford a new carb I will have some known perameters.
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The best part of getting a pipe first is a carb seems cheap later. Mikal on SI has had a series of cracks in his Stage 6. I'd avoid that one. And yeah... I use Lok Tite on every bolt
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Pipe is ordered. Speedaddictcycles has the best prices I have found on LeoVince pipes. Ordered directly from them, there is no charge for shipping on orders over 100$. Through Amazon (such as I did), shipping is just under 11$.
They have a shipment coming in from Italy in the next week or so, so I've got about 2 weeks to get some sh** together. VHT SP115 is en route. I know the pipe comes with springs and some rollers, but I am going to need to get some add'l rollers, I think. Gonna need some jets. I've got an 88 in the wee little keihin just now and a 92 on hand, but will get a few higher. I doubt I will need it, but I've got a 38 idle jet on hand, too.
This is the same model ZXR RP shows as being compatible for the Like, but it was listed as being for the Super 8/Agility 50 2t, which means there will be some adapting involved. I'm sure all but the bolt for the mudguard will line up, as that seems to be the case with anything listed for other Kymco 2t exhausts.
I'll prolly go ahead and order a Jasil 22% contra spring from RP so it'll hit in roughly the same timeframe.
I even have fresh nuts for my vari and clutch (and loctite at the ready).
Round 2 coming up...
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Ha! I think we're getting our pipes from the same shipment! I'm guessing it's this one... if so, we've got some work to do buddy! I just ordered mine and they said it'd be a 5-7 day shipping delay for them to get shipped as well. We're getting the same batch... lol ;D
http://www.speedaddictcycles.com/product/LV-5524R/Leo-Vince-Hand-Made-Exhaust-ZX-R-KYMCO-SUPER-8-50-09-11-AGILITY-50-R16-2-Stroke-10.html (http://www.speedaddictcycles.com/product/LV-5524R/Leo-Vince-Hand-Made-Exhaust-ZX-R-KYMCO-SUPER-8-50-09-11-AGILITY-50-R16-2-Stroke-10.html)
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Get a drill ready... When you install the pipe I find it best to mount the engine side with no gasket to see where the bracket falls. DO NOT try to move the pipe into place. Drill or make brackets. ANY torque from mounting WILL crack the pipe in the future. Can't wait to see how they run for you guys.
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Words of advice definitely appreciated and will be acted upon! I don't anticipate the bolting up to be different from the Super 8 and Agility 2t, but will def make 100% certain of attachment either directly or through modified means before making the full commitment.
psuffix - I had finally had enough of the weakest link in my chain (which will soon be the carb) and started looking aroung and reading more closely posts here and on other forums, paying particular attention to the timeframe in which positives and negatives of each was put forward. Finally with enough scratch coming due, I started seriously looking at prices and shipping times (and availability) and found speed addict. Truth be told, I found them on Amazon, on which it was stated that they had one in stock. I got a call later on Friday to let me know that the pipe would be about a week and a half away from hitting their warehouse stateside and then an additional 3 days for shipping, with the option of cancelling my order with that info. Hell, I would have had to pay through the nose from most places and wait that long anyway for overseas sellers, so I went ahead and committed. We do indeed have some work ahead of us:)
The Scooter Shop out in Orange, CA has a similar price (and free shipping with orders over 50$), but the last time I ordered something from them that was in stock, they had it drop-shipped from SPI as it wasn't really in stock.
At any rate, speedaddict has warehouses in Indiana and CA, so come hell or high water, our sibling pipes are on the way.
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I bit the bullet and reopened the carb. That is the maintenance I dread the most. Not becuase I fear it, but after the work I feel stupid kicking it for a minute or so until the bowl fills up and the engine fires.
At any rate, the float was below parallel. Not crazy low, but not where it should have been. Like a millimeter or two off, but enough for some bogging. I went ahead and put the 85 jet in. When I initially installed the Silent Sport, Steve at Moped Hospital and the fellow from the Scooter Shop in Orange, CA said I wouldn't need to upjet, but I was afeared. 88 (at least in this heat and humidity) has been a skoche too high. The acceleration was hitting a boggy feeling if I went to 3/4-full throttle too quickly. 85 is safely below it (though I would return to 88 in the cold weeks, just to be safe). Hell, I was getting a bog at takeoff, so I knew at least something was amiss.
Funnily enough, I get real rpms from the 1500 spring now. I just thought I felt a difference before.
I have a fairly fresh plug in (though not fresh enough for a proper chop), but will order an extra (as I am ordering a handful for the new pipe) to do a chop this weekend. I am fairly confident I will find a nice brown ring when I do.
Oh, and I am finally going to make the switch to synthetic. I know you dig the Spectro, Z, but I am going to stay in the family and switch to Bel Ray Si7 as I can just add it to the tank when it gets low (but not empty:)) and keep using it. This piston set is well broken in. It is time.
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It is time.
My favorite three word combo! What is the total difference to date? Top mph?
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Well, I, as always, learn something new every day...
Where I had the float was on the lean side, about the same as when I knocked it before. Ran fine yesterday (not the best it has ever, but running, I thought, well.)
This morning I swapped out the Gates belt back to a Kymco. The Gates belt is actually a little longer than the Kymco (about 1-2mm), dead on 17mm (I didn't measure it new, but I seriously doubt it was ever a true 18mm) wide, but never allows for over 40mph.
Anyway, I started out fine this morning, but a few miles in, the bwaap of lean reared its' ugly head and nothing but sputtering above idle. I walked/idled it home (about 4-5 miles) and before pulling the carb, looked at the online manuals to which I have access. I know the Like 50/125 manual refers to the 50 as a 2 stroke, but I really believe that the carb info in it is for the 4 stroke 50, particularly after comparing the carb info in the People 50 2t manual. I went with the float level given for the People and so far, so good. It is lower than I had it yesterday, but not as low as it was coming into yesterday. Too, I switched back to the 88 jet, just for good measure (and not wanting a meltdown, that is best for now).
The outlet on the carb that meets the mani is 16mm i.d., which leads me to believe that it is actually closer to a 14mm venturi. I haven't measured the venturi, but given how carbs are, I wouldn't be surprised. Anyway, I'm about to do some test running.
Live and learn (but stay away from the lean!)
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You've taken off like a downhill snowball Bro! It's great finally getting a handle on these things.
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Livin and learnin and not pushing when it pushes back.
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Never a set of true'r words. It is knowing when to step off that saves these engines. They don't take kindly to a steady beating.
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Have they sent you your exhaust yes wass? If you haven't heard about it yet I'd recommend you give them a call. They posted my order as "completed" without actually sending one, I'd make sure they haven't messed up and done the same thing to you if they haven't sent you a tracking number yet.
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Funny you should mention that. Yesterday I missed a package via FedEx. Thinking it was my overdue Racing Planet order, I was prepared to write Sammy and ask if I had been moved from USPS to FedEx without notification. When I checked the tracking number on the door ticket, though, the package was a 9 pound weight sent from Indianapolis (site of speedaddict's second warehouse), but no info on sender. I had not been sent a tracking number nor info that their shipment had arrived from Italy (though I had been corresponding with them in the interim. I had ordered mine via Amazon and had the transaction initially posted as pending to my bank account, but the monies have yet to be removed from the account). I wait to see if, in fact, the ZX is about to be delivered. I didn't want to jinx it, so hadn't posted anything about this anomaly yet. I'll post when the package is delivered, whether or not it is the exhaust, though I can't think of anything else it could be from Indy.
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It is, indeed, the ZXR. FYI it does not come with clutch springs. It is sent with a set of 5.7g weights (not yet verified with scales). It is NOT sent with an exhaust gasket.
Time to get to work.
I have dug out the wife's dremel and attachments to remove the restrictor cone and smooth out the weld spot. I can't attach the darned thing until I get some jets and plugs, but it's all good. Patience, grasshopper...
I am unsure if I need to go up on the pilot jet. My contemplation is to remove the airbox snorkel, up the pj to 38, shim the needle, and start high with the mj, but that is just contemplation for now.
First things first. Remove restriction, degrease the metal, and get this beast VHT coated.
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Due to monetary restrictions, I may wait to try out the snorkel removal.
I know I am going to need plugs, jets, stiffer clutch springs, and exhaust gasketry (I prefer to have a ring and gasket) as it stands.
I may try out the larger pj for sh**s and giggles.
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Ahhhh The joy of waiting. Starring Bob Ross
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Happy Little Clouds (and Trees).
Bob Ross Remixed | Happy Little Clouds | PBS Digital Studios (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLO7tCdBVrA#)
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You, sir, are a scooter guru officiale!
The pipe doesn't "exactly" fit as shipped (but you knew it wouldn't :) The tube in which the bolt for the engine case underneath the fan is just a few mm forward from where the threaded hole is located in the case. Fortunately, I have access to a fairly well-stocked scene shop and went to get a drill and bit. I ended up using the longest spacer from my Silent Sport and both bolts from the Tecnigas to attach the pipe, but holy crap I can't believe I waited this long!
Tweaking as able around work and pregnant Mama, so no update yet, but it is on, no leaks, and the coating cured.
Thank you for some sage advice!
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Would it be too much to ask for a pic of the work you had to do? Kinda having a hard time imagining what it is I'm going to have to be drilling.
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Not too much to ask at all, though it won't be until tomorrow due to work. It is not difficult, but Zombie is correct about taking the time to line it up. One thing I found was that the smaller bolt in the hardware kut (that attaches the black"hanger" for the pipe) does not go fully through the case's threaded hole, which is why I ended up using the old one from the Tecnigas. I am about to go to the first of two jobs today, so will try to write more tomorrow. I can say that the pipe is well worth the investment and initial attachment.
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It's hard to believe how much work goes into every part. It's like a jig saw puzzle. The difference is we have to trim all the pieces to make them fit. I'll never understand how some guys get away w/ slapping it together.
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So, no pics as I have been balancing work, baby prep and working on the scooter. Here is what has occurred:
With a crush ring gasket only and with the flanges meeting well at the engine, the tube on the pipe for bolting to the case is covering half the hole and the hanging hardware doesn't line up at all.
With crush ring and additional gasket, the tube is completely in front of the case and the flanges are slightly askew, though the pipe hole and the engine port meet up. Too, in this latter configuration, the hanging hardware can be adjusted to match with the second engine case attachment hole. I had originally gone with the last configuration and had to drill a hole in the plate to the left of the attachment tube to get a bolt into the case.
With the crush ring only, it can fit all attachment points, but the pipe flange is a little askew, though as noted before, port and exhaust hole line up. This last config is where I have settled for now.
ParaIndiana (see thread "My Like 50-ish") had no trouble at all bolting his on in its' original form.
Here's my real problem, though: in either configuration, there is a pinhole of an exhaust leak on the underside of the flange. I can feel a very small push of air with each stroke. I have to get a secondary gasket on this thing. Originally, I had gotten the "reinforced" gasket via racing planet, but that prevents the crush ring from fully sealing and the "leak" was more widespread. I will have to poke around for something thinner that I can cut to fit. It is really for the perimeter of the flange, but a leak ain't good, no matter how small it is (though I do think there might have been one with the Tecnigas, as there was one area of it at the pipe flange with a little bit of goo (funnily enough in the same location I found the "pinhole").
Bitch of it is, I am tapped until next week.
For the record, at sea level, an 88 main jet is just a wee bit lean and a 95 too rich. 92 is happy. Perhaps a little on the rich side, but no sputter and I feel safe for the few days in "winter" when our high is 60/low in the upper 30s.
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hey man,
I am behind a s all get out on this thread but was readingf your post from today about the pinhole exhaust leak.....
Everytime I remove the exhaust I always put a thin coat of rvt sealer on the flange as well. This helps stop my pesky, tiny exhaust leaks.
Good top see that you are sticking to it...
I hope to get back on mine next month...... :'(
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Goood call! Thanks, man. I've been banging up my head and hands trying to work it out - all the while fearing over-tightening those nuts. I damn sure don't want to hear the ping and rush of fresh air to the engine.
Fingers crossed for you and September!
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Try some thin copper sheet as a secondary gasket. I have a sheet about 12" by 8", and .5mm thick. A local roofer brought it back as scrap from a job. I've made about 10-12 gaskets so far out of it.
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I will try some added, modified gasketry, but for this morning's attempts I'd like to pass along some practical observations:
I have tried several different configurations. I came closest to fitting the long bolt into the case's threaded hole only with the pipe loosely bolted to the engine and steadily pulling hard on the pipe and wiggling a little. 3/4 of the hole was exposed, but never enough to grab a thread. I think if this had worked, I would have had a heckuva time attaching the y-bracket.
I tried removing one of the exhaust studs, loosely bolting the long bolt through the tube and getting the pipe to go onto the engine mount. Nada.
What I have currently found to be the best configuration with the least amount of leak (and no additional gasket) only has the pipe attached at the engine and at the y-bracket. In this configuration, the pipe flange meets almost perfectly at the engine mount, there is a smaller pinhole of a leak (which will eventually go away, I think, as the crush ring beds in), but there is no attachment at the engine case below the cooling fan - the LV tube for its' longest bolt rests against the case and the hole I drilled is beyond the case threaded hole (which sits at present almost exactly at the point of the weld that attaches the bolt tube to the piece of plate steel.)
How evil will it be to run with only the 2 attachment points?
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Depends on the center of gravity of the pipe, and how heavy it is. If there is ANY torque on the pipe ie: tightening bolts to pull it in place, there is a great chance of it cracking near a weld. That will drive you nutz wondering why you have to keep jetting richer.
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Understood. With this most recent attachment, there was the least amount of the bolts adjusting the pipe into place on tightening and the bolt tube under the fan is held against the case (i.e. the mid section is supported). I am going to go with it for now and monitor. I may see if a j-bolt could be used in that section to give some additional support. It's the lightest exhaust of the 3 I have had on the scoot and the relative center is at one of the y-bracket connections on the pipe. (the one I used to suspend the pipe for vht application, actually)
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I took the scoot out for a run this morning after returning to the 38 idle jet. It may be a little rich at idle, but the transition to the needle is much smoother than the 35. After the run, I could detect no air leak at all, so I'll just figure out how to give a better support since this seems happiest. Top speed has been just under 50 (about 48) with one of my Kymco belts and a little less with the other. the cvt still need a little tweaking and I want to get a new belt (both of my Kymco belts are about 17.25 or less), but for now it is all good. Gotta focus on trying to deliver a baby:)
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Have you picked a name yet? I like Jpres's handle... Kymco Jones! Yup! Kymco Jones Wasonii. You should put his/her application in for the Polini team asap!
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Gotta focus on trying to deliver a baby:)
WOW man that is AWESOME....
Congratulations on the baby..
I seen my lil girl come into this world. A beautiful experience indeed.......
....BUUUTTT...... A VERY DISTURBING something that I may not get to watch again..... :-X
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Delivered this morning. I lobbied for Kymco in the hopes it could have been worked into a new scoot, but m'lady would have none of that...
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Grats wass! I'm sure you're incredibly happy!
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Wooooo Hooooo! A NEW member! I guess we'll see you posting at 4am for a while. Congrats Wass. A hug for the Mrs. as well. (It's not a black baby is it?) :o
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A little Hawaiian, some Cherokee, a whole lotta anglo-saxon/norman, some scots, some german...but we all black in some way ;)
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Wooooo Hooooo! A NEW member! I guess we'll see you posting at 4am for a while. Congrats Wass. A hug for the Mrs. as well. (It's not a black baby is it?) :o
You are sooo bad.
(http://cdn.motinetwork.net/motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/0812/surprise-fail-female-betrayal-birthday-life-born-baby-black-demotivational-poster-1229247435.jpg)
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My wife was shacking in her boots for 9 months. I brought a pistol to the hospital. Just in case...
Lucky her.