KymcoForum.com
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: Stig / Major Tom on May 31, 2016, 07:05:25 PM
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Do you turn off your scooter by using the kill switch?
I never do.
Was told by mechanic that this switch is an emergency shut-off - and that repeated use is not good for the engine because the switch is not letting the scooter shut things down in the proper manner or order.
My son's motorcycle buddies frequently shut down after a ride with the kill switch. Then they turn off the key and remove it.
My LIKE200i a l m o s t starts with the switch in the 'kill' position. Almost....but never does....even seems to fire at times. Never starts. That is what fools me sometimes - (before I notice the switch is in the kill position) and maybe this is the sign that it is NOT good to keep shutting bike down with this switch? Maybe only some of the systems are shutting down with the switch....not all as with a proper "key off" ?
Stig
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Not on any of mine, side stand switch or ignition switch. As far as I know they are all inline, if each is rated to handle the circuit what difference does it make which one you use.
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My kill switch is always off. Always turn the scoot off with the key. Once on may Super8 I flipped it by accident going down the road. It worked. Guess at the start of every riding season I ought to check them to make sure they still work.
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Me too, meaning I don't use the kill switch. I HAVE unknowingly bumped it to "stop" and it ALWAYS takes me a bit to figure out why no instrument panel self-check, no starter and no run!
Karl
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Theres a kill switch.....
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See, that is what gives me a little thrill every time that kill switch gets me!
On my LIKE200i everything kicks into action - but the scooter will not start with the switch in the 'don't-run' position.
Makes you play with throttle, wonder about fouled plug, out of fuel?, flooded it?, etc.
Owner's manual incorrectly states it won't start with side-stand down. (there is no such switch on side stand of a LIKE)
The other day when I was finishing a few hours of work on the Burgman's CVT - I wanted to watch the CVT with the cover off before buttoning it all back up.
Hit the starter -.....nothing. D e a d .
Then I saw the side stand was still down (down, to facilitate side panels coming off) Flipped it up. Scoot starts.
But it always gives me a little thrill when my scooter will not start. An unusual experience for me - Honda, Kymco & Suzuki scoots are that reliable.
(http://i67.tinypic.com/2rqzx3c.jpg)
(http://i64.tinypic.com/1zc1e0.jpg)
(http://i68.tinypic.com/kcxr41.jpg)
Stig
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When I took my motorcycle safety course, we were encouraged to ALWAYS use the kill switch so that if an emergency happened, we would automatically be in the habit of using it. And we would use it without having to think about it. It makes sense to me. Someone implied that the kill switch is more robust . And using it will prevent (relatively) heavy current from passing through the ignition switch before its fully in position. -- Makes sense in theory. But in practicality, I doubt it matters since the switch was designed with this in mind. But using it all the time so I will automatically reaching for it in an emergency does seem like a good thing. It can't be a bad thing.
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Owner's manual incorrectly states it won't start with side-stand down. (there is no such switch on side stand of a LIKE)
My Burgman 650's won't crank with the side stand down. Weird thing on the MyRoad is it will crank and start with the side stand down but the engine shuts off within a few seconds unless it is up.
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Never touch the thing. Never had on any of my rides in the last 40 years.
Side stand shut offs are the first thing I disable. Just my preference.
AMAC
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The only time I turn off the kill switch, is when I accidently hit it when washing the scooter.
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Interesting to read bike forums/mags about these kill switches.
Lots of differing ideas/opinions.
"Just in cases....." (a line from my fav movie) I'll keep using the key so as to protect the ECU from any possible trauma.
Probably IS good safety idea to be more familiar with the switch.
Stig
@@win a free donut if you can name the movie!@@
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Love Actually.
How do I claim my donut...? :lol:
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Love Actually.
How do I claim my donut...? :lol:
Well I'll be darned.....
D'nut is in the Royal Mail..... (if this is the Forza owner I think it is?)....
Stig
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Kill switch does not turn anything off, it only kills the engine
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The kill switch for me is for emergency shut-off only. I do cycle it with the key in the off position at least monthly to help remove in oxidation build-up on the contacts.
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Well I'll be darned.....
D'nut is in the Royal Mail..... (if this is the Forza owner I think it is?)....
Stig
Yes, its me.
How about I pop down the local shops get me a donut and send you a PayPal invoice?
Just say no.
More donuts is the last thing I'm needing!
Am currently considering replacement options and popped in here to see if there was any new info/stories about the Xciting 400.
This has only been offered in black in the UK till now, but I am informed by a representative of the importer that white will become available soon.
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Yes, its me.
How about I pop down the local shops get me a donut and send you a PayPal invoice?
Just say no.
More donuts is the last thing I'm needing!
Am currently considering replacement options and popped in here to see if there was any new info/stories about the Xciting 400.
This has only been offered in black in the UK till now, but I am informed by a representative of the importer that white will become available soon.
You and me both - have sworn off donuts - just go for the coffee and excuse to ride.
I know you're not inclined to buy from early production models....but has the 400 been around for awhile in Asia and Europe? Bugs all out?
The Kymco 300's are the big sellers here in the States - sadly without ABS....and can be found well below list price as left-overs. Fairly bullet-proof - the 300's
I am most impressed with Kymco quality & price & serviceability ( the actual sell prices are much better than list - most places)
and would have loved to test any Kymco 400ABS before buying the Burgman 400ABS. I needed more capacity than the NSS300 and was not going to settle for anything without ABS.
No point fussing about KYMCO distribution policies - they've been around a long time. They make their best guess - and send us only those models. But, they make so many mid-size scooters we could be choosing from!
This is the USA - we're lucky anybody sells scooters in this market.
A 400i question - why are they marketing with a video of a guy riding in sport bike behavior? People who want to ride a sport bike would pay less, and not buy a scooter.
http://www.kymco.com/product/category/Scooter/Xciting400i/video.asp (http://www.kymco.com/product/category/Scooter/Xciting400i/video.asp)
Ride safe up there in Scotland (isn't it?),
"Hello, my name is Stig and I used to eat donuts."
"Hello Stig!"
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Guess I’m the outsider. Always used the Kill Switch. After nearly six years of riding, never had any electrical problems related to it -- only your typical battery and spark plug ones. It was stressed in the BRC course, and when I was rear ended at a toll plaza, the first thing I did was to hit the kill switch when me and my bike were pressed into the side of the toll booth. Did the same thing when I had my wipe out on an icy manhole cover. First thing I did and think when I went to pick up my bike was to hit the Kill Switch.
It’s part of my muscle memory.
- Wolf
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Guess I’m the outsider. Always used the Kill Switch. After nearly six years of riding, never had any electrical problems related to it -- only your typical battery and spark plug ones. It was stressed in the BRC course, and when I was rear ended at a toll plaza, the first thing I did was to hit the kill switch when me and my bike were pressed into the side of the toll booth. Did the same thing when I had my wipe out on an icy manhole cover. First thing I did and think when I went to pick up my bike was to hit the Kill Switch.
It’s part of my muscle memory.
- Wolf
It seems that you and I are the only ones who ALWAYS use the kill switch. As I stated earlier, my BRC instructor told us the same thing. He stated that by ALWAYS using the kill switch, we would AUTOMATICALLY reach for it in case of an emergency. It makes perfect sense to me.
The switch is robust. And it's no different as far as the engine computer is concerned than using the key.
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I honestly can't understand the resistance to using that switch.
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Disabling side stand switch sounds like a good idea
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Disabling side stand switch sounds like a good idea
For me it was a necessity.
After its been euthanized be very careful. Unlike a cycle it's always in gear so any roll of the throttle and to scoots on the ground .
AMAC
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The side stand kill switch makes sense to me. There have been times I’ve tried to start up my bike with it down, and the first motorcycle accident I ever read about in a newspaper as a kid -- sometime in the 70’s -- was of a MC rider who started his bike at night, took off and a few blocks away he wiped out when taking a left turn and was killed. His side stand was still down.
The idea that a vehicle could kill you because you forgot something was pretty freaky as a kid. For me the side stand kill switch is a good safety feature.
- Wolf
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My Kymco Dealer, Burger's in Flemington, NJ, advised me not to use it. I only use the key to turn off the ignition.
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The side stand kill switch makes sense to me. There have been times I’ve tried to start up my bike with it down, and the first motorcycle accident I ever read about in a newspaper as a kid -- sometime in the 70’s -- was of a MC rider who started his bike at night, took off and a few blocks away he wiped out when taking a left turn and was killed. His side stand was still down.
The idea that a vehicle could kill you because you forgot something was pretty freaky as a kid. For me the side stand kill switch is a good safety feature.
- Wolf
The guy that drives off with the side stand down has attention issues.
45 years and 100s of thousand of miles and I never pulled out with the stand down. Of course vintage Harley's don't have stand kills anyway. It's only there because the legal depts thought it was a good idea to protect idiots.
I've done plenty of other idiotic stuff back in the day but that newbie move isn't one of them.
I use my scooter every day as transportation and there are many times that I'm off it for a very short time and as soon as the stand goes down it shuts down. Thirty seconds later I'm back on and it's starter time again.
It's only purpose is to help thoses that shouldn't be on two wheels anyway.
AMAC
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The only time I turn off the kill switch, is when I accidently hit it when washing the scooter.
I did the same thing a couple of years back. I couldn't understand why my GT300i wouldn't start! Goes to show you how often I use it (never)
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I just bought a Yamaha Majesty. And the kill switch is MUCH easier to reach than the key. So shutting it down with that is only natural. You have to reach down somewhat to reach the key. My shutdown order is 1. kill switch . 2. Side stand. 3. Key.
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When I took my motorcycle safety course, we were encouraged to ALWAYS use the kill switch so that if an emergency happened, we would automatically be in the habit of using it. And we would use it without having to think about it. It makes sense to me. Someone implied that the kill switch is more robust . And using it will prevent (relatively) heavy current from passing through the ignition switch before its fully in position. -- Makes sense in theory. But in practicality, I doubt it matters since the switch was designed with this in mind. But using it all the time so I will automatically reaching for it in an emergency does seem like a good thing. It can't be a bad thing.
This is something to consider. It makes sense to be familiar with all of your safety equipment.
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When I recently called the dealer-mechanic to say I had a question about my new-ish Like 200i, he immediately said, "Lemme guess, you want to know why it's so hard to start after using the kill switch?"
We didn't talk more about it, since that wasn't my question, but it reinforced my feeling that the switch was a problem. I've only used it accidentally three times at intersections -- and each time I had to push the bike to the side of the road because I couldn't get it started right away. Seemed flooded or something. The last time it happened I didn't panic, but carefully turned the key all the way off, then tried to start it normally, but still had issues.
So I was surprised to read here that some people swear by it. I was googling around to see if I should completely disable it (since my hand nearly caught it again at an intersection this morning).
Wondering if those who say there's no difference between using the key and kill switch have tried starting it right after killing it?
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Kymco has known about this problem since at least 2014. My wife's 2013 Like 200 experienced this issue back in 2014. We brought it back to our Kymco dealer, Burger's in Flemington, NJ, under warranty. They tried replacing the switch but that didn't fix it. They ended up consulting with their technical folks in SC and still could not come up with a fix. They advised us not to use the kill switch and we never have since that time. I've never had a problem with any of my other Kymcos' kill switches, but since that time, I stopped using it on all of my scooters.
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Kill switch ? Yes, I have one with that label, and I use it to stop power to the engine. Every time I stop and intend to get off.
Then I turn off the key which controls power to the other systems.
Reverse order for starting procedures. Lift the sidestand with its safety switch, turn on charging/light circuits and wait for the display to go through it's routine, then I depress the brake with it's safety switch, and apply the starter button after turning the kill switch to the ON position. Works fine, for me.
I suppose there might be a different sequence others could use effectively.
redk
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The early Honda Goldwings did not kill the engine with the side stand down, consequently one unfortunate rider took off with it down, started to turn left and pogoed himself into a light pole, killing him dead. Maybe that's why nowadays the side stands on most, if not all bikes, kill the engine when down?
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5 or 6 years ago , just about everyone had trouble from the kill switch, I have not used it since then, I have hit it by chance a few times and wondered why it would not start,
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interesting thread...my MSF instructor taught us all to use the kill switch every time we shut down...referencing the 'muscle memory' thing. i use it on my motorcycle and scooter...no problems so far. I doubt it causes any trouble.
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Side stand switch on all my scoots.
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I was told to use the kill switch, so that if an emergency happened, it would be an AUTOMATIC reflex.
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OP here, well in reading about the use of the kill switch - it certainly does not seem to grenade the bike if used frequently.
Some are taught by instructors to use it.
My issue is that manufacturers don't seem to adhere to standardized positioning of the controls. I didn't try use my Forza's horn very often .....but when I did - I would angrily flash a turn signal at the offending car! Maybe Honda is the only one who positions the switches so.?
Stig
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I was told to use the kill switch, so that if an emergency happened, it would be an AUTOMATIC reflex.
Thanks good buddy for this tip as I had never heard of this and am learning this for the first time. Make perfect sense to me and will develope the routine.
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Tig makes a good point: There are no uniform standards on controls and switches. When I ride my BMW bikes I have to relearn the position of the turn signal switches. I suspect the reason most Japanese and Chinese bikes have the same switch positions is because they probably buy them from the same factory, not because they want to create a standard for us riders. At least the kill switch seems universal, always atop the right handle. Has anyone seen it elsewhere?
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Both the side stand and the red emergency switch take your coil straight to ground. On some bikes it also keeps the ignition off and on some it doesn't. On all bikes the key kills it all. Both are mandated by the federal gov. traffic safety board. Big brother is watching out for you. Fuel on, stand up, neutral light on and emergency switch to run, now that you've performed all these preflight chores, you are finally ready to shout CONTACT.
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Both the side stand and the red emergency switch take your coil straight to ground. On some bikes it also keeps the ignition off and on some it doesn't. On all bikes the key kills it all. Both are mandated by the federal gov. traffic safety board. Big brother is watching out for you. Fuel on, stand up, neutral light on and emergency switch to run, now that you've performed all these preflight chores, you are finally ready to shout CONTACT.
and the wright Bros. are off again, are you catching up to me in age,. live long and healthy, so you can ride!!!!!!! ;D ;D ;D ;D
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I use the kill switch to cut the engine, then turn the key off. Works for me.
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And that's what really matters, Mr. Paul. Whatever work for each of us. Turning the emergency switch off each time can certainly do no harm. If they teach that in the m/c safety classes, then adhere to their instruction. They know what they are talking about. Wishing all safe scootering.
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Side stand switch on all my scoots.
This is in the for what it's worth department. Your side stand switch comment made me think of it. When I had my accident last year, I had all kinds of trivial thoughts before I realized what condition my leg was in.
Some of them were:
1.Why can't I get this thing back under control? This median wasn't that big of a jump.
2. What was that that just broke my wind shield?
3. Why did my instrument cluster just pop out?
4. Why did I just fall?
5. Wow! I'm rolling.
6. Am I going to be able to ride it home without the cluster?
7. My Allstate motor club gives $200.00 free towing. Will I have to come out of pocket?
8. (This is the one your side stand comment brought to mind) After the scooter flipped several times, it fell on its side then jumped back up and started "ghost riding" for a short distance.
I remember thinking "I thought that thing had a kill switch to shut it off if it fell on it's side?" "Oh, it finally shut off"
9. Is that thing totaled?
10. Man! I'm going to be late for church this morning!
11. (After reality starts setting in) . MAN! My leg's hurting real bad.
All those TRIVIAL thoughts happened between the time I hit the median , hit the mystery objects (sign posts) that broke my windshield, instrument cluster, AND LEG, and the time me and the scooter stopped tumbling and came to a rest. In retrospect I actually LAUGH when I think about it.
12.Then I looked at my leg and saw the extent of the damage to ME and I VERBALLY expressed my next thought .
JESUS! JESUS! JESUS!
In retrospect, that was the MOST rational thought of them all. I know it was the most helpful. [emoji16][emoji1488]
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This is in the for what it's worth department. Your side stand switch comment made me think of it. When I had my accident last year, I had all kinds of trivial thoughts before I realized what condition my leg was in.
8. (This is the one your side stand comment brought to mind) After the scooter flipped several times, it fell on its side then jumped back up and started "ghost riding" for a short distance.
I remember thinking "I thought that thing had a kill switch to shut it off if it fell on it's side?" "Oh, it finally shut off"
It's crazy the things that can run throught ones mind in a few seconds. I have triggered the tip over sensor on my '03 B650 when hitting a pothole broke my front rim years ago, the bike sputtered and wouldn't run right for several minutes after.
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I was told in motorcycle training to use the kill swich. So in an emergency you will hit it without hesitation.
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I always use it. :D
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I use the key only and have never had any problems.
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I followed up with my mechanic today about this. He said it was "known" that 200i's can have trouble restarting after using the kill switch. He said the CDI freaks out. Resetting involves 5-10 quick on/off cycles with the key. His advice? Don't use the kill switch.
Of course this is not relevant to owners who have had no problems with the switch. But for someone who has had restarting trouble every time I've used it, his advice makes sense.
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Forbes1984.
Wow.
I hope you are healed up and OK now.
Yes, I've kinda been through that type of sequence before. A few times.
Then, others, I'm just kinda shaking myself off, wondering how whatever it was happened.
( Many years on the dirtbikes, we Were gonna crash at least a few times each day.. )
Good to be here talking about it. :-)
redk
I will never forget my friend Ray, as we were side-hilling on a loose shale surface when he decided to put up his foot to gain some leverage around a cactus, which promptly broke off, leaving him with his bluejeans and leg full of cactus spines, right where he fell ! lol
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Forbes1984.
Wow.
I hope you are healed up and OK now.
Yes, I've kinda been through that type of sequence before. A few times.
Then, others, I'm just kinda shaking myself off, wondering how whatever it was happened.
( Many years on the dirtbikes, we Were gonna crash at least a few times each day.. )
Good to be here talking about it. :-)
redk
I will never forget my friend Ray, as we were side-hilling on a loose shale surface when he decided to put up his foot to gain some leverage around a cactus, which promptly broke off, leaving him with his bluejeans and leg full of cactus spines, right where he fell ! lol
Yes, I'm up and about. Back at work. I still have two legs. But one is original equipment. And the other is an "aftermarket edition " . Lol. But I'm thankful. I'm still getting used to the prosthesis. But I'm adapting well. God is good. I've shared a lot of my progress and struggles in another thread.
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I followed up with my mechanic today about this. He said it was "known" that 200i's can have trouble restarting after using the kill switch. He said the CDI freaks out. Resetting involves 5-10 quick on/off cycles with the key. His advice? Don't use the kill switch.
Of course this is not relevant to owners who have had no problems with the switch. But for someone who has had restarting trouble every time I've used it, his advice makes sense.
Yeah,
I kinda agree with your mechanic.
I've been told that the kill switch on some bikes/scoots is a quick interrupt - but not in the healthiest mechanical/electrical sequence - to get the engine shut down.
There's deciding to hold your breath - then there's choking on a chicken bone.
Like that....good science!
Stig
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I should use the red stop/run switch just like MSF BRC said but I don't. I should use the switch just to keep it exercised. I ain't to sure about the "scramble" thing, cause all it does is cut power just like the key and the sidestand switch.
Karl
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I should use the red stop/run switch just like MSF BRC said but I don't. I should use the switch just to keep it exercised. I ain't to sure about the "scramble" thing, cause all it does is cut power just like the key and the sidestand switch.
Karl
I agree. Off is off. And to my knowledge it doesn't cut power to anything that is not cut when the key is turned. I haven't riden in a while. Refresh my memory. Does the emergency kill switch turn everything off, or just the engine? If my memory is correct, it simply cuts power to the engine, but the rest of the electrical system is still on.
At any rate, we humans are creatures of habit. And muscle memory allows us to do things by instinct without thinking. Using that logic, if an emergency happens, we'll hit the kill switch without thinking and without having to take our hands off the handlebars rather than instinctively trying to use the key and drive one handed.
Just my thinking....
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If you try to start with the emergency kill in the off position and the engine spins but doesn't start, then it only grounds the coil. On the other hand , same as about and nothing happens, then it has disabled the ignition and everything else. It can be either way, depending on the brand of bike. The NTSB only requires the the emergency kill switch stops the motor.
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If you try to start with the emergency kill in the off position and the engine spins but doesn't start, then it only grounds the coil. On the other hand , same as about and nothing happens, then it has disabled the ignition and everything else. It can be either way, depending on the brand of bike. The NTSB only requires the the emergency kill switch stops the motor.
[emoji1474]
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[emoji1474]
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Thanks guys!
TAPI
(The American Poultry Industry)
not stig